Discussion relating to the operations of MTA MetroNorth Railroad including west of Hudson operations and discussion of CtDOT sponsored rail operations such as Shore Line East and the Springfield to New Haven Hartford Line

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, nomis, FL9AC, Jeff Smith

  by Nyterider
I'm having a tough time planning a railfan trip on this line this summer. One of the things that will help me decide whether to bother is this: Is there still jointed rail on the line north of Suffern? If so, I'd like to take one last clickety-clack ride in NJT equipment. But if it's already been replaced by CWR, I'll postpone this trip. Unless someone has specific information stating otherwise, I'm assuming Metro-North will complete welded rail installation on the entire route this year.

  by Sirsonic
There is still stick rail from the Division Post (just west of Suffern) to Arden (just east of Harriman). This is about 10 miles, maximum speed is 60 mph. The curves west of Tuxedo (around Tuxedo rocks) have been welded rail for some time. Also, from Black Rock (east of Port Jervis) to Port Jervis is stick rail.

  by Nyterider
Thanks. Yes, E-L was pretty good at installing welded rail early on certain curves. The next day(s) I can possibly make it up there are July 8 or July 29. Will I be in time to witness "history"? :wink: I look forward to getting welded rail on the rest of this line, however, as it's certainly overdue.
  by northjerseybuff
I read a few years ago that Metro North was going to fix up the Port Jervis yard/station area..has this been completed as of yet?
Last time I was up there on a weekend, the crew(inbound and outbound) had to handthrow a Drail and switch taking several minutes..why not make that move a thing of the past?
  by Erie-Lackawanna
They still do, and I'm not aware of any project in the works to change it. Eliminating that particular hand-throw switch is not a trivial matter, due to the exhorbitant cost of installing a remote controlled interlocking. Moving the switch so it's west of the station platform isn't possible, given the yard and main line configuration at that location.

The Port Jervis Yard Improvement Project was completed in 2004.

  by TDowling
Does Metro-North still lease the Port Jervis Line from Norfolk Southern, or have they bought it outright?
Last edited by TDowling on Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
  by Passaic River Rat
According to the MN sub-lease of the Southern Tier: PRR (the company created for the Conrail carveup) owns the line. NS leases the line from PRR (25-year term) Metro North subleases the line from NS.
  by Erie-Lackawanna
The PRR-NYC structure of the Conrail transaction was dissolved 2 years ago, with STB permission. NS now owns outright all of the assets once held by the PRR paper organization, and CSX now owns outright all of the assets once held by the NYC paper organization. PRR and NYC no longer exist - again.

The lease terms include a provision that the lease is automatically assigned to successors of either NS or PRR (but not MNR).

  by oknazevad
First I've heard of that.

Hey Jim, you got a citeable source for that? I'd like to update the wikipedia articles on the PRR/NYC "paper" railroads (good term, btw), and without a source, I'm sure any changes will be reverted by the less-informed. Thanks in advance.
  by oknazevad
Gracias senor.
  by TDowling
Yes, thanks Jim. I am posting an idea about weekend service to Woodbury Common, which I hope will get a discussion rolling. Be sure to respond--thanks!

  by TDowling
Someone please inform me if this is a bad idea...a weekends-ONLY stop at the northern extremity of Woodbury Common outlet center, with access to the proposed facility via 2 options: 1. Turner Road off Route 32; 2. the intra-mall loop trolley. It seems as if MNR has tossed around every conceivable idea but this, and yet this seems to make the most sense for EVERYONE. This plan would alleviate traffic on 32 during the weekend shopping peak times, attract more people to the mall without using parking, AND generate revenue for MNR.

I do not understand why so much time and money was spent assessing the cost and impact of a major station stop at the WC a few years back. There is already a major station a few miles down the road with plenty of room to expand and ShortLine bus service going there besides.

However, if trains were to arrive at WC from Hoboken at, say, 10:30 AM and 12:30 PM, and stop on the return trip at 4:00 PM and 6:15 PM on Saturdays and Sundays only, then more people would take the PJL.

In addition, how about a weekend flagstop for hikers at Arden (between Harriman and Tuxedo) where the Appalachian Trail crosses over the PJL and the Thruway. The hudson line has these at Manitou and Breakneck Ridge, and I believe the Harlem Line does too in Dutchess County.
Last edited by TDowling on Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
  by DutchRailnut
Would making special stops, not set a precedent and get other merchants to sue cause MNCR is giving certain shopping area's preferential treatment ???
I don't think a tax payer supported transportation agency can or could, support one business but not another.
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