New MBTA Fare Policy Draft

danib62 wrote:I wonder if the bus pass will still be valid on the surface green line stations. Something tells me the answer will be no as they will now charge for outbound rides. Previously if you just rode surface on the green line it wasn't worth it to get a subway pass because you just rode one way so they allowed bus passes on the surface. Now since they will charge both way I bet they will stip allowing the use of bus passes. This means that bus pass green line users will now have to buy a $62 pass instead of a $31 a %100 increase in fare! These may be the people getting the biggest shaft in the fare hike.

That's quite true. I've heard a lot of talk about plans to charge outbound on the green line. I can see both sides, however I think the people who say it should be free need to think about the other subway lines. Just becasue you can't make a connection going outbound on the street level, doesn't mean the service is worthless. If you were at Harvard going to Alewife it's only a few stops outbound but you still pay. Yes I know that heavy and light rail are different, etc. but if you think that it should be free than the last X amount of stops on all lines should be free, and you know that's not happening.

I wonder how many people really use bus passes on the green line. I watch as people board usually if I can and I very rarely notice a bus pass being used. If only the old fareboxes gathered stats like the new ones can maybe they could actually base the fare policy on the number of specific types of passes used on the service.

Oh well... stand by for 2009 when they'll want to raise it again.

JS

According to the proposed info: "Senior cash fares equal 40¢ for local bus
and 60¢ for rapid transit and half fare for all other services except The RIDE. Children aged 5-11 and students pay half fare on all services."

Well, first off, I don't do buses, I now drive my little "President Clinton" midsize SUV

Now, that would be 1.20 roundtrip for subway/streetcar, up 50 cents from what it is now, and in other words, that's a quarter more that what it is now at 35 cents (one-way) for red/blue/orange/green lines.

They also mentioned that the increase in parking is to balance the elimination of exit fares on the red line and zoned inbound prices on the green line.

Oh ok, I see, I see. Now that makes sense, especially Braintree, South Quincy and Quincy Centre, with having do take out coins for parking fees, all I have to do then is give them a 5 dollar bill

Reddy Rocker wrote:I read the PDF regarding the monthy passes and other fare changes, but it was a little vague in my situation.

It wasn't clear on whether I can use the OnePass on the inner express bus (426/428) or if I would have to start using a Zone 1 pass (I would rather not pay a partial fare, seeing that cash payments will now have a surcharge added). And if I choose the OnePass, would I have to pay the difference?

I must reiterate the same question because although the one following it got answered, this one was apparently ignored. Seriously, I'm looking for an answer here, but like I said before, the MBTA site was vague about this.

Reddy Rocker wrote:

Reddy Rocker wrote:I read the PDF regarding the monthy passes and other fare changes, but it was a little vague in my situation.

It wasn't clear on whether I can use the OnePass on the inner express bus (426/428) or if I would have to start using a Zone 1 pass (I would rather not pay a partial fare, seeing that cash payments will now have a surcharge added). And if I choose the OnePass, would I have to pay the difference?

I must reiterate the same question because although the one following it got answered, this one was apparently ignored. Seriously, I'm looking for an answer here, but like I said before, the MBTA site was vague about this.

Take a look at page 12 of http://www.mbta.com/traveling_t/pdf/200 ... crease.pdf It clearly states that the Inner Zone Express Bus pass is proposed at $89. As described earlier in the policy, it would be valid for all services below that cost, including the function of a OnePass (Subway + Local Bus).

JS

danib62 wrote:I've heard a lot of talk about plans to charge outbound on the green line...

Apparently this T management is not comprised of the previous generation when they had passengers pay to get off the outbound train on a Green Line surface station. All this does is just slow down service drastically, and not to mention the bottleneck in the car with people coming out/in one door.

I grew up in Cleveland Circle in the 1970s and remember as a kid accompanying my parents that IIRC passengers had to pay to exit the PCC train. Even at that young age, I thought it was a ridiculous method. As I recall, they stopped that practice when the LRVs arrived.

I wonder how many people really use bus passes on the green line....

A few years ago, I used to do that. Only because at that time [1] the bus pass was cheaper, [2] I didn't need to go downtown often, and [3] usually my Point B is almost always another Green Line surface station.

Here's a link to a story about how the T may "cut" the planned fare hike. Just as someone said somewhere in this thread.
Do they think we're all morons?
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massac ... fare_hike/

Of course you have to imagine that the proposed cuts will error on the side of too much revenue...regardless of how the public process ends up cutting the fare increase back, at the end, the T still has the same budget hole to fill. If they didn't factor in a contingency for such an occurance, they could end up in the position of implementing a reduced fare hike, and then still having to make service cuts to balance the budget.

A Globe editorial this morning finally made the best point about the fare hike. If you're unhappy, don't vent at the T -- they don't control a lot of their playing field. If you're really worked up, write you state legislators -- they're the ones that set up the financial structure which has led to the necessity for these fare increases:

MBTA riders concerned about the latest plan for a fare increase should focus their anger on the state Legislature, which in 1999 changed the way that the T was financed so that regular increases were inevitable. This will be the third one in 6 1/2 years and the MBTA should tailor it to minimize loss of ridership.

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editor ... es_fairly/

My prediction is that the T will back down from surcharging CharlieTicket users and just surcharge cash riders on the buses and green line surface stations. They will also allow for system-wide transfers when you use the CharlieTicket.

danib62 wrote:My prediction is that the T will back down from surcharging CharlieTicket users and just surcharge cash riders on the buses and green line surface stations. They will also allow for system-wide transfers when you use the CharlieTicket.

Agreed. The CharlieTicket is definetely slower, but still better than using cash. With all this talk of cash surcharges it really makes me wonder if they are going to put vending machines at the green line stops. It would speed boarding and make the system more equitable to those who don't live near an underground station to add money to their Ticket/Card.

JS

sabourinj wrote:Agreed. The CharlieTicket is definetely slower, but still better than using cash. With all this talk of cash surcharges it really makes me wonder if they are going to put vending machines at the green line stops. It would speed boarding and make the system more equitable to those who don't live near an underground station to add money to their Ticket/Card.

JS

Machines at green line stations won't be necessary to add value to the CharlieCard. One can do this right at the fare box. There is a button you push on the fare box, you then flash your CharlieCard, then insert money and then flash your card again. Though this would slow down boarding immensely. Ideally they would have vending machines at least at the major stations.

Personally I think the idea of a surcharge for using the CharlieTicket is ludicrous. Especially at subway stations because there the only person you slow down is yourself!

p.s. congrats sabourinj on your 100th post. I'm almost there myself!

danib62 wrote:Machines at green line stations won't be necessary to add value to the CharlieCard. One can do this right at the fare box. There is a button you push on the fare box, you then flash your CharlieCard, then insert money and then flash your card again. Though this would slow down boarding immensely. Ideally they would have vending machines at least at the major stations.

Personally I think the idea of a surcharge for using the CharlieTicket is ludicrous. Especially at subway stations because there the only person you slow down is yourself!

p.s. congrats sabourinj on your 100th post. I'm almost there myself!

Haha thanks, I wouldnt' have even noticed.

I know that you can add money at the farebox, but this slows down boardings. If there was a machine at some of the stations (not sure if it's even possible outdoors, but bear with me here) you could add value without holding up the train (or even buy passes!). I doubt it would happen, people would probably destroy them overnight anyways.

JS

100 posts? Rookies.... Just kidding...

I have heard (but can't remember where) that there are "all-weather" vending machines in the works for, at least initially, the D Line stops (which for the most part have enclosures to put them in to keep them out of the rain and snow).

octr202 wrote:100 posts? Rookies.... Just kidding...

I have heard (but can't remember where) that there are "all-weather" vending machines in the works for, at least initially, the D Line stops (which for the most part have enclosures to put them in to keep them out of the rain and snow).

100, 1000? who cares... I was just glad when the "new member" message went away

I don't think it's that hard to makeoutdoor versions, after all ATM's can be installed outdoors. The concern I would have more is vandalism. People with spray paint or knifes scratching the screen or something. The MetroNorth railroad uses S&B's vending machines and those are outdoors on the platform, with only a roof over them (like Lehcmere).

I still can't get over the fact you won't be able to buy CharlieCards from the vending machines. This seems proposterous since they supposedly want to get them in as many hands as possible...

JS

sabourinj wrote:

octr202 wrote:100 posts? Rookies.... Just kidding...

I have heard (but can't remember where) that there are "all-weather" vending machines in the works for, at least initially, the D Line stops (which for the most part have enclosures to put them in to keep them out of the rain and snow).

100, 1000? who cares... I was just glad when the "new member" message went away

I don't think it's that hard to makeoutdoor versions, after all ATM's can be installed outdoors. The concern I would have more is vandalism. People with spray paint or knifes scratching the screen or something. The MetroNorth railroad uses S&B's vending machines and those are outdoors on the platform, with only a roof over them (like Lehcmere).

I still can't get over the fact you won't be able to buy CharlieCards from the vending machines. This seems proposterous since they supposedly want to get them in as many hands as possible...

JS

You know, I had totally forgotten about the old "new member thing"...

I hope also that these machines are more "flexible." I know SEPTA's ticket vending machines that can't scan the redesigned dollar bills -- definately a low point in transit fare machine engineering...

Where did we learn that you won't be able to buy CharlieCards from vending machines? I can't seem to find it again at this point. I can understand how the ticket vending machines might not be able to dispense them, but I'd hope that there are plans to have stand alone CharlieCard vending units, much as WMATA uses. My frist and only SmartTrip came from one at the New Carrollton station quickly and easily on a trip to DC a while back...it'd be a shame to not at least have that at major stations.

[quote="octr202]
You know, I had totally forgotten about the old "new member thing"...

I hope also that these machines are more "flexible." I know SEPTA's ticket vending machines that can't scan the redesigned dollar bills -- definately a low point in transit fare machine engineering...

Where did we learn that you won't be able to buy CharlieCards from vending machines? I can't seem to find it again at this point. I can understand how the ticket vending machines might not be able to dispense them, but I'd hope that there are plans to have stand alone CharlieCard vending units, much as WMATA uses. My frist and only SmartTrip came from one at the New Carrollton station quickly and easily on a trip to DC a while back...it'd be a shame to not at least have that at major stations.[/quote]

In one of the MBTA Fare Policy documents that came out lately it said something about them being sold at locations where monthly passes currently are, or something like that. I'm not possitive but it led me to think you couldn't get them from the machine.

S&B can and has designed vending machines that vend smart cards, so if ours don't, I think the T is crazy for not getting them. Hopefully I'm wrong.

JS