New MBTA Fare Policy Draft

It looks to me like if I want my monthly OnePass to still work on the commuter rail (for zones 1A and 1B), I will need a CharlieTicket rather than a CharlieCard. This is unfortunate.

danib62 wrote:Also if the reason for the surcharge on the CharlieTickets is to encourage people to get a CharlieCard and speed up boardings on buses and the green line why are they going to continue to issue passes on CharlieTickets at the same price?

That's a good point. Looking at the T's chart, the holdup seems to be that the Commuter Rail and Boat won't support the cards until after sometime after CharlieCards go on sale and people can use them (stored-value and monthly passes) throughout the system. I'm guessing that once the entire system is CharlieCard-aware you won't be able to get passes on CharlieTickets anymore. Or, the T may have decided that want to give monthly/weekly pass holders a consistent set of discounts, and that the vast majority of people who buy monthly/weekly passes will prefer the convenience and speed of the CharlieCard.

I think that the increase in boarding speed of charliecard vs. stored value charlieticket is not significant enough to warrant an over 30% price difference (green line $1.70 + 0.55 surcharge), especially considering that paying cash at the farebox which takes much longer than swiping the ticket is exactly the same price. The cash fare surcharge is at least arguable, for example the added time to process the fare, and cost of dealing with the money in the fareboxes (sorting, counting, etc) that does in the end cost the T a fair bit. The charlieticket surcharge (particularly when boarding the red, blue, and orange lines) is on the other hand ridiculous. Even more ridiculous is the free bus-subway transfer using the card, but double-payment using the stored-value ticket.

The real aim here is twofold: first, they are able to make the single-ride fare increase seem lower than it really is by separating the fare and surcharge during the discussion. Second, they have not stated how much a charliecard will cost. Taking Chicago's example, if would be $5 following some introductory free period. Replacement cost for a lost card is also $5. Occasional riders are faced with a dilemma: go out of their way to buy a charliecard (they will not be available at machines, you will have to go to a designated sales point) knowing that it will require several rides to break even and a lost card will require another investment, or pay the extra fare for a ticket. Most will choose the latter, and the T is counting on it. On the other hand, a reduction of single-fare rides will also be a good argument in the future for cutting service in off-peak hours.

To help reduce the cost of the commuter rail increases, why not provide monthly passes and month combo passes. If you purchases a monthly pass, you would not be allowed to ride the bus or subway without purchasing additional fares.

The monthly combo pass would be in eqivalent of the exisitng monthly commuter pass.

With the Automated fair equipment such a combination of passes would be possible, and it might allow for smaller increase for those willing to give up the subway option.

Robert Paniagua wrote:I'll take this fare increase in stride, mainly that when this fare goes up after the end of this CY, all stations should be automated with the Charlie Card. Now, I wonder how much will Senior Citizens/TAP will cost. Now, it's 35 cents, will it be 50 cents?

I also notice that parking fees will once again be affected, especially the last three stops on the SSQBE Red Line. Right now, they are 3.50, up $1 from four years ago, now, it's gonna double over three times...

According to the proposed info: "Senior cash fares equal 40¢ for local bus
and 60¢ for rapid transit and half fare for all other services except The RIDE. Children aged 5-11 and students pay half fare on all services."

They also mentioned that the increase in parking is to balance the elimination of exit fares on the red line and zoned inbound prices on the green line.

JS

danib62 wrote:I'm getting a feeling that the T made this fare increase very high so they can later knock it down a little after the meetings and look like they care. Anyone remember how buses were supposed to go up to a dollar during the last increase but after people complained they knocked it down to 90 cents and looked like heroes. I have a sense that the surcharges may go down a little or may be eliminated for charlieticket riders who put a certain amount on their card.

Also if the reason for the surcharge on the CharlieTickets is to encourage people to get a CharlieCard and speed up boardings on buses and the green line why are they going to continue to issue passes on CharlieTickets at the same price? I think if I get a pass I'm going to purposefully get it on a ticket just so I slow down boardings on the green line and buses and stick it to the T! (I'm joking! please don't send me hate mail calling me inconsiderate and the like!)

I'm assuming that eventually they will be charging for the actual CharlieCard itself. Every other transit system in the US that has a proximity smart card charges for the card (Chicago is giving them away free for a period to encourage use). Because of this, if they didn't offer passes on the free CharlieTicket there would be issues of people who can't afford the pass let alone buying the card too. Also for services like the commuter boat and rail you need the CharlieTicket so the info is printed on it, where as the CharlieCard has no printing on it. These services will eventually have handheld validators, but for some reason that seems to be down the road further. That's my guess anyways.

JS

Things that aren't clear in this proposal yet:

- will a OnePass be accepted on the commuter rail for travel in zones 1A and 1B?

- if I have a OnePass or a local bus pass, and I want to ride an express bus, do I pay the full fare, or just the 'difference' ?

- is a commuter rail pass accepted on an express bus?

Ron Newman wrote:Things that aren't clear in this proposal yet:

- will a OnePass be accepted on the commuter rail for travel in zones 1A and 1B?

- if I have a OnePass or a local bus pass, and I want to ride an express bus, do I pay the full fare, or just the 'difference' ?

- is a commuter rail pass accepted on an express bus?

As far as the commuter rail pass on express bus, I think it is. They mentioned somewhere that a pass for a higher value service will work on all lower ones, so pretty much any CR pass would work I think.

JS

Ron Newman wrote:Things that aren't clear in this proposal yet:

- will a OnePass be accepted on the commuter rail for travel in zones 1A and 1B?

- if I have a OnePass or a local bus pass, and I want to ride an express bus, do I pay the full fare, or just the 'difference' ?

- is a commuter rail pass accepted on an express bus?

You will be able to use the OnePass on zones 1A and 1B but you will need to have your pass printed on a CharlieTicket so the conductor can tell what it is. There is no way of telling without a scanner with a CharlieCard.

Since the OnePass will now come in 1-day, 3-day, and 7-day variations, I'm not sure how the commuter rail conductor will determine its validity anyway. If the T's system is like New York's, these passes start validity when first used, not when purchased.

Ron Newman wrote:Since the OnePass will now come in 1-day, 3-day, and 7-day variations, I'm not sure how the commuter rail conductor will determine its validity anyway. If the T's system is like New York's, these passes start validity when first used, not when purchased.

See the post above yours. They are planning to use handheld devices that can scan the CharlieCard to see what is loaded on it (validate pass or deduct money from a stored value). If you have a CharlieTicket the information is printed on the ticket so it is easy to tell.

You won't be able to put a commuter rail pass on a CharlieCard until these devices are implimented. Also, the 1, 3 and 7 day passes are not available for the commuter rail, only the OnePass (todays subway + combo pass). They start from the date purchased, not the first time used like NYC.

JS

sabourinj wrote: You won't be able to put a commuter rail pass on a CharlieCard until these devices are implimented. Also, the 1, 3 and 7 day passes are not available for the commuter rail, only the OnePass (todays subway + combo pass). I'm not sure if they will start when purchased or first used like NYC.

JS

Ahh but that's where you err. Today's subway and combo passes are good on the commuter rail for zones 1A and 1B. A 1, 3 or 7 day pass is good on these zones.

danib62 wrote:Ahh but that's where you err. Today's subway and combo passes are good on the commuter rail for zones 1A and 1B. A 1, 3 or 7 day pass is good on these zones.

Well then that may be a change? The Zone 1A and 1B passes are the same cost as a OnePass, but must be printed on a CharlieTicket since the CharlieCard will not be accepted on the CR immediately. The 1-7 day OnePass just says valid for local bus and rapid transit, so I'm guessing no longer on the CR?

If you haven't looked, check out http://www.mbta.com/traveling_t/pdf/200 ... crease.pdf page 12 and see if you see something I missed.

JS

I read the PDF regarding the monthy passes and other fare changes, but it was a little vague in my situation.

It wasn't clear on whether I can use the OnePass on the inner express bus (426/428) or if I would have to start using a Zone 1 pass (I would rather not pay a partial fare, seeing that cash payments will now have a surcharge added). And if I choose the OnePass, would I have to pay the difference?

I wonder if the bus pass will still be valid on the surface green line stations. Something tells me the answer will be no as they will now charge for outbound rides. Previously if you just rode surface on the green line it wasn't worth it to get a subway pass because you just rode one way so they allowed bus passes on the surface. Now since they will charge both way I bet they will stip allowing the use of bus passes. This means that bus pass green line users will now have to buy a $62 pass instead of a $31 a %100 increase in fare! These may be the people getting the biggest shaft in the fare hike.