2013-14 Train Show Season.

Otto, sounds like a lot of thought has gone into the planning. Now - what can they do about the 4 to 6 inches of global warming which is supposed to arrive Saturday?

BR&P wrote:Otto, sounds like a lot of thought has gone into the planning. Now - what can they do about the 4 to 6 inches of global warming which is supposed to arrive Saturday?

Think warm thoughts!!

-otto-

Otto Vondrak wrote:

Matt Langworthy wrote:

umtrr-author wrote:I hope I'm wrong about this for the club's sake but I think holding this show 11 and 10 days before Christmas is a bad idea. People have other things on their minds that close to the holiday-- unless they are shopping for trains. Certainly I do.

I also think having the show in December is a poor idea because there so many other holiday related activities going on. Hopefully, someone at RIT will put it back in November where it belongs.

Nope, never in November, sorry Or any other time, for that matter. And here's why...

Thank you for the explanation. I can certainly appreciate the planning which goes into the show, and it has looked good each year I've attended. Having said that, being so close to Christmas is a difficult time for the reasons I've stated. If there ever is a means to schedule the show earlier in the year, I'm sure it would be appreciated.

Benjamin Maggi wrote:

lvrr325 wrote:Attendance was down, just over 3400 - IIRC last year was almost 2000 more. Hallway was deserted at show's end, I'm thinking there was some other event there elsewhere in the complex last year, because you had to push through crowds to get to the second elevator bank.

Typically, there are other events at the plaza on the same day as the GTE. The lighting of the Christmas tree outside on the plaza, the indoor craft fair, and the "Chocolate Expo" in the NYS Museum all take place traditionally on the same day. This year, the first Sunday fell on the same weekend as Thanksgiving. The GTE stuck with the rule of "first Sunday in December" and everything else picked the next weekend. I even heard that the State asked the GTE to move back a week, but arrangements had already been made.

The loss of foot traffic from the general public was appreciated, but I am sure attendance was down because people were either out of town due to the holidays, or else the "oh look, a train show too" crowd didn't materialize because of the change in date for the other events.

The down crowd was probably about 50-50 a combination of the holiday and the lack of other events. I stopped by a mall on the way home and that wasn't particularly busy either.

Once a show establishes itself on a particular weekend, they don't have much choice but to stick with it. A weekend either way you can sometimes juggle around depending on how the calendar shakes out. Move too far and you conflict with other shows - plus re-establishing on a new date, you may as well be starting over again as a brand new show. GTE could probably have waited the week, the only conflict off the top of my head would have been that TCS Syracuse show, but for instance Batavia ended up a month off when they lost their normal weekend in November.

Particularly with a smaller show, you put yourself in a conflict that costs you dealers, that's liable to hurt future attendance - people will remember it as a piddly little show with a lousy selection of stuff, they're going to be less likely to come back. It's sort of a downward spiral then.

Old & Weary wrote:Batavia's October show was due to a temporary booking conflict at the Hotel. 2014 dates are back to April 6th and November 9th.

First I've heard they're back to November for next year, last I spoke to them they thought it might still be in October, but a week or two later. Well, I suppose I'll find out soon enough. Outside of that, that's not new information.

Reporting live from Tiger Tracks... My booth is located next to the Alco Tech booth... All I've heard this weekend are these three fighting and snarking with each other like a bunch of 12 year olds.

Aside from the weather taking a bite from attendance, this show has gone veery well for all involved.

-otto-

In the end it was acceptable sales-wise, down from last year but I expected it would be with the weather. And it was miserable Saturday night, I think Rochester got more snow than Syracuse did.

I noticed a couple of larger vendors who've done that show a few times were absent; I forget who they were but they were multiple table folks, one carries mostly Woodland Scenics and N trains and sets up a booth. Another that also did a booth that would have lots of O-gauge stuff, die cast cars and figures and things.

On the other hand there were a couple of larger vendors I hadn't seen before, too. But I sure am glad I don't have to cover costs for a whole bunch of tables like they do. It's hard to get anybody to spend more than about $20, although I did sell two locomotives Sunday afternoon... one of them I put together Sunday morning. But the NIB DCC stuff? would get put down like a hot potato once they saw the price.

As usual, I found some stupidly good deals on Sunday afternoon not even really looking for them, too.

As usual, I found some stupidly good deals on Sunday afternoon not even really looking for them, too.

Then you get folks like Otto who turned down an offer to pay him $15 to take a box of Official Guides. I think he would have done it for $20, but maybe not.

BR&P wrote:

As usual, I found some stupidly good deals on Sunday afternoon not even really looking for them, too.

Then you get folks like Otto who turned down an offer to pay him $15 to take a box of Official Guides. I think he would have done it for $20, but maybe not.

I'll give ya $25... No wait, I'm bad at this, sorry. $35!!! THAT'S MY FINAL OFFER!

-otto-

lvrr325 wrote:I noticed a couple of larger vendors who've done that show a few times were absent; I forget who they were but they were multiple table folks, one carries mostly Woodland Scenics and N trains and sets up a booth. Another that also did a booth that would have lots of O-gauge stuff, die cast cars and figures and things.

A couple multi-table vendors cancelled on us last-minute because they were either in the midst of or on the other side of the "snow belt" and didn't want to risk travel. On the flip side, we were able to convert a couple of empty table spaces on Sunday, so it all worked out. Hopefully the weather doesn't play as big a factor next year!

It's hard to get anybody to spend more than about $20, although I did sell two locomotives Sunday afternoon... one of them I put together Sunday morning. But the NIB DCC stuff? would get put down like a hot potato once they saw the price.

Truth. Newbies to the hobby shudder when they see a price tag for a new DCC-equipped locomotive with sound (SOUND!!). These are also the same guys who balk at $8.00 for an old Tyco beater, too.

As usual, I found some stupidly good deals on Sunday afternoon not even really looking for them, too.

As did I, there was good stuff to be found everywhere.

Once again, thanks to everyone who supported Tiger Tracks. Overall reaction from vendors and attendees was positive, despite lower attendance due to weather. The train show is a fundraiser for the RIT Model Railroad Club, and proceeds help fund our activities, which mainly consists of constructing the new layout. See our progress at http://www.ritmrc.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

I'm looking forward to supporting the other shows in the region as we move into 2014...

-otto-

The event itself was well-run and it was obvious the group has put a lot of effort into fine-tuning things. They can't control the weather and they can't control what people will buy. I didn't do well, but it obviously was a combination of not having what most people were looking for, and pricing what I had too high. What I lost in money I made up in social enjoyment, I saw old friends and former co-workers who I had not seen in many years. I lost a little money but had a durn good time doing it!

I never know what some vendors are thinking. I watched one guy put out flats with some stuff that has bounced around and smashed itself into junk, or was horribly kitbashed or badly weathered and would need repainting, all overpriced and sell none of it - but he sold some older HO brass passenger cars and a couple of older P2K locos (priced for more than they typically sell for on eBay, too, I just checked one and another I looked up a few months ago) and actually sold more than I did. I can't figure that out, I price the stuff at or below eBay and carry it home and he's pricing it higher and selling it? More power to him, I suppose.

I went to the "train show" @ the Broadway Market today. Total waste of time. 3 or 4 vendors, maybe 6 or 7 total tables & they were only 1/2 full of items, that's it. Not worth the gas money to even drive over there.

Thanks for posting that, I remember seeing the flyer, but I also seem to recall the last one they had was a joke too, so I forgot about it.

Yeah, that flyer, it was a piece of artwork in itself. I didn't expect much but this thing was over & done with in about 2 minutes, lamest supposed "train show" I've ever been to & I've been to almost all of them. My wife had a rare Saturday off & she went with me. First thing she said when we got there, searched around, & found the tables was "This is it?" I made out ok anyway because there was a table in a different part of the market that had nothing to do with the show but he had a book I bought with pictures of the waterfront from 1905. That was pretty cool but it wasn't part of it anyway.

EL5232 wrote:1. Clear out the Junk. Some tables seemed more like flea market fare. Toys, matchbox etc. Its a train show. Not a flea market.

One man's junk is another man's treasure! You're gonna get some tables full of junk Tycos mixed in with the vendors selling NIB. That's kinda what a train show is all about...

December is great for club ticket sales - not great for vendors and hobbyists. The show is also getting too late in the season. A busy season, two weeks before Christmas when dedicated modelers don't have as much money or time available. Brick and mortar shops are in their busiest time of year and can't spare three days away from their customers. The weather is also unpredictable for visitor turnout and traveling vendors.

The show is late in the year, but we really haven't seen that have a negative effect on attendance numbers as we have been experiencing an upward trend over the last eight years. Weather plays the biggest factor, we have to worry about being snowed out (and snow certainly played a factor this year). As I've tried to explain before, the date's not changing, we're the December show in Rochester. So if you're busy with other commitments or have already spent your hobby cash for 2013, we thank you for supporting the hobby in other ways and we're sorry you're not able to join us for Tiger Tracks. Someone is going to have to explain all of the people I saw leaving with full bags, though...

This years show was definitely smaller. Look at the pic of the 2012 show on RITMRC Facebook - compare it to this years pic.
I see more open orange space in the 2013 pic.

You saw more open space because we had one vendor cancel for snow, one vendor cancelled for medical reasons, and we rearranged tables and layouts to compensate. Table sales were our highest ever, actually. Look for more positive changes in 2014.

The original thought behind the 2 day show was to bring in more layouts. The thought was more layouts meant more people through the door, more money for the club.

Not quite... The reason for hosting a two day was to be able to bring in more vendors and more layouts, and to attract the larger vendors who would not bother with the expense of travel and setting up just for a one-day show. Certainly a larger show with more vendors and layouts is more attractive and does indeed help us bring in more people through the door, which in turn helps our fundraiser.

I figure after 7 years of two day shows and around 6k to 7k through the door, after show expenses, the club has to have plenty of cash in the bank.

While the train show is indeed a fundraiser for the RIT Model Railroad Club, we have the same expenses every year. I'm not sure how much "plenty" is, but we have enough to fund construction of the layout and to fund the operation of the train show (and all of its related expenses). The support of the public is crucial to our success!

Nice to see the fundraising finally being applied to the new layout, can't wait to see it progress.

The one year without a layout was torture. Having trains running again in A420 was very exciting! You can follow our progress on our web site at http://www.ritmrc.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and on our facebook fan page http://www.facebook.com/ritmrc" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I think it would be great to go back to hosting two one day shows in spring and fall back at the Student Union and let the club layout be the star again. Might be a better experience for vendors, hobbyists, and easier for the club to organize around their semester schedules...

Do you work for Greenberg Shows or something? Why would we go back to running two painfully small train shows with no chance of growth? Those old cafeteria shows were fun, but they were a stepping stone to what eventually would become Tiger Tracks. We are enjoying our success and we're never going back (and we thank the local vendors who have stuck with us from the beginning).

Look, if you don't like the train show, we understand if you don't want to come. There's only so much time/dollars you can devote to the hobby. But your perceptions of "success" and "convenience" may be skewed. Tiger Tracks is a very successful operation, it's a positive event for the Rochester area model railroading community, and our vendors tend to agree as they come back year after year (and our waiting list for tables grows).

-otto-