MN equipment needs as per MTA July 2014 board meeting.

[DutchRailnut]

MNR Procurement Strategy for M-9, Dual Mode Locomotives and Multi-Level Coaches
1. MNR will pursue funding in the 2015-2019 Capital Program to purchase up to 188 M-9 Cars for the replacement of its M-3 fleet and cars for electric territory ridership growth.

2. In addition, MNR will develop specifications for Dual Mode Locomotives and Multi-Level Coaches for diesel territory coach and locomotive replacement and ridership growth and potential use for Penn Station Access.
--- LIRR options for replacement of its locomotives would be discussed.
--- A Clearance Inventory study is underway to determine what areas of the terminal (Grand Central Terminal) need to be modified in order for multi-level coaches to fit.

Metro-North M-8 Car Procurement

1. $1.1 billion contract with Kawasaki Rail Car.

2. Funded by the State of Connecticut and Metro-North

3. 405 M-8 cars; 380 in married pair configuration and 25 single cars

4. Provides service on New Haven Line and Shore Line East

5. Allows for retirement of M-2, M-4 and M-6 car fleets

6. 356 M-8 Cars in service ... Provides 77% of revenue service

7. MDBF of 182,117 miles YTD through May, 2014

8. Customer reaction has been extremely positive

9. Customers have commented positively on the interior, the amount of space on the cars and the seats, outlets at every seat, etc.

M-8 Issues
Car Performance: As is common in new car procurements, especially with a car as complex as the M-8 car, a number of initial issues have to be resolved and are being addressed with the car builder. Some include:
1. Auxiliary Power Supply Cooling Fan

2. Automatic Train Control Relay Circuit Board

3. Pantograph Control Valves

4. Transducers and Speed Sensors

KRC has been using the New Haven CSR Shop which has been leased to them for on-site field modifications as required.

Appendix B ... Metro-North Rolling Stock Summary

Type of Car, Average Age as of 7/2014, Total # of Cars, Planned Replacement
1. M-2 / M-4 / M-6, 31 years old; 115 cars; ONGOING (retire)

2. M-3, 30 years old, 142 cars; retire in year: 2019

3. M-7, 9 years old, 336 cars; retire in year: 2047-2050

4. M-8, 1 year old; (currently) 356 cars; retire in year: 2050-2053

5. Coaches, 18 years old, 278 cars; retire in year: 2025-2030

Locomotives:
6. DM, 14 years old, 31 cars; retire in year: 2025

7. DE, 13 years old, 27 cars; retire in year: 2025

http://web.mta.info/mta/news/books/pdf/ ... 0_CPOC.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[freightguy]

They have been testing in Grand Central Terminal this week for the heights of different tracks with a laser for double decker cars.

[DutchRailnut]

its not height that's problem, only place the LIRR C1's were restricted was tunnel tracks 3 and 4 , due to s curves at north end, and a few switches which had signals to close for comfort when car swung out in center on diverting moves.
the loop is even high enough but the third rail and signals would get knocked over.

[Thomas]

They have been testing in Grand Central Terminal this week for the heights of different tracks with a laser for double decker cars.

What are the interior tunnel dimensions of Metro North's Park Avenue Tunnels?

[shlustig]

IIRC, the most restrictive point for clearances is the reverse curves on tk. 3 at E. 86th St.

There were scrape marks on the ceiling from the FL-9's, and that is also where the PC clearance car met its demise.

Within Tower A's plant, the interlocking provided lateral clearance protection on some routes with tight turnouts.

[SouthernRailway]

So the M-7s will be at least 43 years old when they're retired?

[deandremouse]

They have been testing in Grand Central Terminal this week for the heights of different tracks with a laser for double decker cars.

What are the interior tunnel dimensions of Metro North's Park Avenue Tunnels?

15' - 6" center
14'- 3" as it curves to the wall then from there 13'-9"
A multilevel has about a foot of clearance by the roof will fit

[F-line to Dudley via Park]

So is MNRR still evaluating an independent purchase of multilevel EMU's as their M3 replacement, or are they more or less settled now on picking up their M9 options in 2016?

And have they given any indication as to numbers and timing of the MLV coach procurement, or is it just clearance testing and technology evaluation for the moment?

[DutchRailnut]

That info is clearly described in document posted.

[Thomas]

15' - 6" center
14'- 3" as it curves to the wall then from there 13'-9"
A multilevel has about a foot of clearance by the roof will fit

Thanks!

But, this means that NJ Transit's MLV's can not be used for future Metro North Service through the Park Avenue Tunnels. Thus, is it a strong possibility that no multilevel will be able to get used?!

[DutchRailnut]

The NJT multi levels are same height as our Genesis, and we run those in all 4 tunnels on daily basis.
overall max height in park avenue tunnels is 14' 6" for equipment height.

[F-line to Dudley via Park]

That info is clearly described in document posted.

I read the posted doc, and no...it's not.

-- p. 10-11 sets the deadline for executing the M9 option. It doesn't say whether they're still evaluating either/or alternatives.

-- p.18 shows coaches as a lump-sum line item saying all 278 go by 2025-30. Well...there's 4 generations of Shoreliners with an age range of 12-32 years. It says nothing about what the next procurement is going to be or what it'll replace, only when every replacement procurement has to be. Or gives any indication as to whether the procurement schedule's driven only by end-of-life replacements or by capacity expansion needs requiring expedited decision on the first replacement order.


That's why I asked the question. To find out if they went into any additional detail elsewhere about those two areas.

[Terrapin Station]

That info is clearly described in document posted.

I read the posted doc, and no...it's not.

...

That's why I asked the question. To find out if they went into any additional detail elsewhere about those two areas.

DutchRailnut has made that mistake in the past. A few months ago, when we were discussing the Bar Cars on this forum or some other one, I asked a question about the revenue of the Bar CARTS vs. Bar CARS per staff-hour of attended operation and DutchRailnut claimed that the numbers I was seeking were available in the MTA Budget documents. So I spent time looking through them and couldn't find them. Turns out DutchRailnut was completely wrong and didn't have a clue as to what I was asking. He needs to stop saying "it's in the document" when it clearly isn't.

[runningwithscalpels]

Can we not turn this into Subchat? Kthxbai.

[RearOfSignal]

So is MNRR still evaluating an independent purchase of multilevel EMU's as their M3 replacement, or are they more or less settled now on picking up their M9 options in 2016?

No one ever mentioned multi-level EMU's. M9's will not be Multi-Level. Multi-Levels will be coaches.

To quote the previously linked document on pages 10 and 11...

"Metro-North will pursue funding in the 2015-2019 Capital Program to
purchase up to 188 M-9 Cars for the replacement of its M-3 fleet and
cars for electric territory ridership growth.

• In addition, Metro-North will develop specifications for Dual Mode
Locomotives and Multi-Level Coaches for diesel territory coach and
locomotive replacement and ridership growth and potential use for
Penn Station Access.
– LIRR options for replacement of its locomotives would be discussed.
– A Clearance Inventory study is underway to determine what areas of the
terminal need to be modified in order for multi-level coaches to fit. "