High Speed Amtrak

If you could choose five routes to make high speed rail on Amtrak (assuming that they also become electrified), what would they be? Mine would be:

1) Harrisburg - Cleveland - Chicago
2) New York City - Albany - Montréal
3) Washington D.C. - Richmond - Raleigh
4) Chicago - Saint Louis - Kansas City
5) Washington D.C. - Cincinnati - Chicago

-Phil

NYC to Poughkeepsie would be hard, as New Rochelle to Poughkeepsie is owned by Metro-North. But mine would be the section of the Capitol Limited (nice little "route guide" pamphlet in the Roomettes!) with the straight 68.5 mile section of track (according to the pamphlet) that is east of some PA (?) or MD station. MD-WV would be hard because of the many S-curves.

I would like to see Washington DC to Flordia electrified but that would also involve probally building a new track. With the flat land, high speed rail would probally be very doable.

I agree with your routes to although parts of the NYC-Mont. route might be hard to electrify.

Where do any of you propose to find the money?

I have a friend who works for EDS. They have a very simple corporate saying:

"No Bucks, No Buck Rogers."

as New Rochelle to Poughkeepsie is owned by Metro-North

How are you going to run from New Rochelle to Poughkeepsie…? That's a long way down through the Bronx to reach the wye that leads to the line through Morris Heights and Spuyten Duyvil

Also, the original poster has not defined what he means by "high speed rail".

Irish Chieftain wrote:

as New Rochelle to Poughkeepsie is owned by Metro-North

How are you going to run from New Rochelle to Poughkeepsie…? That's a long way down through the Bronx to reach the wye that leads to the line through Morris Heights and Spuyten Duyvil

Oh yeah. I guess I got the New Haven line and the Empire connection mixed up. Haha, sorry.

Also, the original poster has not defined what he means by "high speed rail".

You're right. But in fact, Amtrak does reach 'high-speed' (110mph from Albany to Schenectady assuming measured mileposts), but not for long. But given how rough the train rocks back and forth at this speed though, I wouldn't opt for anything higher.

To John:

While funding wouldn't come from anywhere, I do like to stretch my imagination!

I can't complain about Chicago-KC now. It's faster than the Chicago-STL-KC route. It's either 79 or 90 mph most of the way.

And as far as defining what Amtrak high speed is, that's a joke waiting to be made... but without making the joke, I will say it includes running on BNSF.

F40 wrote: You're right. But in fact, Amtrak does reach 'high-speed' (110mph from Albany to Schenectady assuming measured mileposts), but not for long. But given how rough the train rocks back and forth at this speed though, I wouldn't opt for anything higher.

No 110 mph between Albany and Schenectady. The only 110mph capable track is between Hudson and Albany on that route.

As others have noted, this topic needs some parameters. High speed here, for example, certainly isn't high speed as defined in other countries. My supposition is that HSR starts at speeds beginning at 125 MPH. My other premise is that HSR will not be competitive beyond 500 miles. Ergo, anything beyond that, ie. DC-Florida, is throwing money away.

My supposition is that HSR starts at speeds beginning at 125 MPH

If that's true, then trains hauled by the Deutsche Bahn 101-class (virtually the same locomotive as NJ Transit's ALP-46, just minor differences) are high-speed rail, since they operate with trains at top speeds of 137 mph.

My other premise is that HSR will not be competitive beyond 500 miles

Depends on what you call "competitive". A real dedicated-corridor HSR line connecting New York with Chicago could possibly have running times of 4½ to 5 hours between endpoints.

[quote="Irish Chieftain]Depends on what you call "competitive". A real dedicated-corridor HSR line connecting New York with Chicago could possibly have running times of 4½ to 5 hours between endpoints.[/quote]

Don't see that happening with steel wheels on steel rails. Perhaps, with maglev, and lots of moolah. Takes political will first, though.
"Competetive" in my statement means siphoning off traffic that would normally go to airlines flying about the same distance. For example, as part of a study of HSR in the Midwest, the thinking was that a good 25% of flights leaving O'Hare could be replaced by HSR, if it were in place.

Don't see that happening with steel wheels on steel rails. Perhaps, with maglev, and lots of moolah

It's already happening with steel wheels on steel rails—Japanese bullet trains already operate at average speeds that would allow such times. Maglev not necessary, unless you're trying to beat the airliners going transcontinental…(but still, a train doing NY to LA in about 16 hours has my business.)

PS. Enable BBCode for those quote tags to work.

Irish Chieftain wrote:

Don't see that happening with steel wheels on steel rails. Perhaps, with maglev, and lots of moolah

It's already happening with steel wheels on steel rails—Japanese bullet trains already operate at average speeds that would allow such times. Maglev not necessary, unless you're trying to beat the airliners going transcontinental…(but still, a train doing NY to LA in about 16 hours has my business.)

PS. Enable BBCode for those quote tags to work.

True, but the title of the topic is High Speed Amtrak, so we need to discuss the topic about what's going on here, not there.

the title of the topic is High Speed Amtrak

I know. Wouldn't you also like that to not be oxymoronic?

I think the best HSR routes worthy of investment are:

Boston-Miami
New York-Montreal/Toronto
Washington-Chicago
Chicago-STL-KC
Seattle-San Diego

Haveing a HSR network on the coasts where the population density is higher will make money for medium haul travel. If you could make WAS-CHI in 4-5 hours, then hell yes that could put a damper on E. Coast-CHI flights because not only do the trains get to the city center, but are much more productivity frendily. If our government gets out of bed with the oil companies, then we can see some changes which willk greatly help our country.