• Catskill Mountain Railroad News - 2010

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.

Moderator: Otto Vondrak

  by DonPevsner
 
(1)Alan Gerry, who became one of the largest stockholders in Time-Warner when he sold his Sullivan County cable company to it in 1996 (for $2.3 billion, of which he netted $900 million),is based in Liberty, Sullivan County. He went from an ex-Marine, high-school dropout to an individual who was #301 on FORBES' list of the 400 Richest Americans in 2008. He donates to environmental, educational and medical causes, and now heads his own hedge fund (Granite). He bought Max Yasgur's Bethel, NY farm (of "WOODSTOCK" fame), and built the Bethel Woods Art Center on it several years ago. While it is far too late to resurrect the NYO&W, he could pay for the total U&D restoration from his pocket-change if an effective presentation convinced him to do so.

(2)Sue Erpf de Bovencamp is the widow of the late Wall Street tycoon Armand G. Erpf. She is active in Catskills affairs.

(3)The A. Lindsay and Olive B. O'Connor Foundation, of Delhi, NY, funded the purchase of the ROW from Highmount to Bloomville in 1978, and has also funded the restoration of the DURR between Highmount and Roxbury. Donald Bishop II is the key player. As there will be no mutually-beneficial passenger rail tourism synergy between the DURR and CMRR until the line is passable between Kingston and Highmount, perhaps the Foundation would consider a larger investment east of Arkville, as well as coordinating an approach to other regional foundations that have the funds to get the job done.

(4)The Pitcairn family of Pittsburgh has lived in Shokan for many decades. The family founded Pittsburgh Plate Glass.

(5)The 19th century railroad tycoon, Jay Gould, was born and raised in Roxbury, NY, and is buried there in the family mausoleum. He left an $80 million estate (Cornelius Vanderbilt's estate was $100 million) in the latter part of the 19th century, when estate taxes did not yet exist: equal to about $8 billion today. His descendants are real-estate tycoons in Washington, DC today. There is a natural "fit" between the Gould family and the U&D. They could probably assist with approaches to foundations as well. Check-out "KIngdon Gould", starting with the local phone book and ending on the Internet.


Government alone does NOT have to foot the bill.
  by lvrr325
 
DonPevsner wrote: (b)Finally, the dream of Steve Delibert, late President of the U&D Historical Society, was to use the abandoned ROW of the U&D from Roxbury to West Davenport and the "D&H connector" from there to Cooperstown Junction, plus the existing former D&H trackage between Cooperstown Junction and Cooperstown, to establish a through tourist railroad all the way from Kingston to Cooperstown. While contingent upon both adequate outside funding and the feasibility of acquiring possibly-reverted ROW land parcels by condemnation if necessary, this amazing vision would actually cost less than the new Ulster County Jail in Kingston will cost to build
What made me dismiss the entire post and any other posts as being without any basis in reality, is the above quoted piece.

You see, the original Delaware & Otsego line of Walter Rich was located on the Oneonta end of this line via a lease from the NYC - which ended when the state condemned (or perhaps simply purchased from the NYC) a portion of the property to build I-88 across it. So you kind of have this problem of either needing to bridge over the interstate, or make the state build you a pair of bridges and dig the ROW back out to go under it. This is not just reconditioning some old abutments and hanging a new bridge on them.

I don't even want to hazard a guess what it would cost just to get to the point where construction could begin on that project. Surveys, engineering studies, environmental impact studies, bridge design and construction, fighting NIMBYs and lawsuits... one only need look at what's gone on with the Lackawanna Cutoff restoration in New Jersey to get an idea of the scope of the costs - and that's an intact ROW with exception of a couple of bridges, that has always had a single owner for it's entire length, that's wanted for public mass transit use. To rebuild the upper end of the U&D would entail re-aquiring the ROW from multiple owners, with who knows how much reconstruction needed. And for a tourist line at that. I would hazard a guess that you will sooner be able to travel to the moon, by train, as travel from Oneonta to Kingston via the U&D.

I also wouldn't be surprised to find out that a rail route to the moon would cost less to build. Just to re-grade and build track from scratch on an existing ROW runs about a million bucks a mile. There's a lot of track between the D&U's north/west end and Oneonta that would have to be built from scratch. Plus a couple chunks further towards Kingston that are washed out and just plain gone.

The CMRR does a pretty good job for an all-volunteer outfit with limited resources and equipment, and I would think their best course of action would be to continue restoring the ROW and try to find funds to repair the bridges that seem to be the biggest obstacles to rebuilding their portion of the line.
  by onder
 
If the line was intact from where it begins now to Roxbury, and good for say 30 mph, what would the passenger loads be like? What would the cost of running the service be and how much to maintain it all, track structure and running costs? In other words, how much would it cost and how much of that cost can you generate? And the 64 dollar question, "how much will the taxpayer have to fund EVERY year?" That is why I'm pretty pessimistic about having
appetite bigger than stomach. Im impressed by the progress made, understand the idea of pump priming but sadly I think it unlikely that it will ever go past maybe Grand Gorge.
  by eehiv
 
Sunday, February 21st.


On Sunday, Earl Pardini led a crew at Cornell street consisting of Mark Glaser, Bob Blake, John Patane, Joe Marsh, and Joe Klapkowski.

They installed new decking on flat car 201, and started up the new spike puller.

Ernie Hunt
Volunteer Coordinator
CMRR
  by eehiv
 
Saturday, February 27th

On Saturday, George Peck will lead a crew meeting at Phoenicia between 8:30am to 9am. Plans are to continue to do boltwork somewhere east of the Route 28 crossing in Mt. Pleasant with the work train. However, they also may be spending time in the yard digging out if the snow is bad Thursday.

There will be no work scheduled for Kingston on Saturday.


Sunday, February 28th

Annual Volunteer meeting at the Phoenicia Station starting at 10am.


Ernie Hunt
Volunteer Coordinator
CMRR
  by JoshKarpoff
 
What's the current MoW equipment roster?
I know you guys have in recent months gotten the tamper, ballast regulator and now a spike puller all up and running, but what other equipment fills out the roster?
What MoW equipment does CMRR own, but is currently out of service?
Is there any piece of MoW equipment that is high on the wish list?
  by eehiv
 
Josh,

We have a ballast regulator, tie handler, scarifier/inserter, gradall, hi-rail dump truck (out of service, but being fixed), plus a couple cranes and backhoes. Our liner, which is out of service, is next on the list for refurbishment, and we are getting a second tamper. We just got a spike puller.

Our top search now is for an industrial size tree chipper for our brush crew. We also keep an eye out for a spiker, possibly a compact tie inserter if the price is right.

EH
  by eehiv
 
To all CMRR Volunteers:


It looks like Phoenicia got 4-5 feet of snow, and instead of a volunteer meeting tomorrow, we will be having a Phoenicia dig out, led by George Peck.


Any volunteers who have snow removal equipment, skis, or snowshoes should report to Phoenicia tomorrow (Sunday) between 8:30 and 9am to help out. Please meet at station road (back entrance). Bring whatever equipment you can.


We need to clear snow away from equipment, get access to equipment and the station, and get snow off the roof of the station, trailer, and section house.


There are also lots of trees down in Phoenicia and along the ROW, so bring a chain saw.


Anyone who has a camera, please bring it and send me photos if you can. This is the largest snowfall in at least a generation at Phoenicia, and we want lots of pictures!!



Ernie Hunt
Volunteer Coordinator
CMRR
  by eehiv
 
To all:

The CMRR got hit pretty bad by the snow. As stated above, Phoenicia got 4-5 feet, though Mt. Pleasant got "only" 1-2 feet, Shokan about a foot, and Kingston about 6-8 inches.

Hunter and Tannersville got about 6 feet over the past few days, and I've heard that the DURR got pretty badly hit.

I'll post more info as I get it.

EH
  by Jtgshu
 
eehiv wrote:To all CMRR Volunteers:


It looks like Phoenicia got 4-5 feet of snow, and instead of a volunteer meeting tomorrow, we will be having a Phoenicia dig out, led by George Peck.


Any volunteers who have snow removal equipment, skis, or snowshoes should report to Phoenicia tomorrow (Sunday) between 8:30 and 9am to help out. Please meet at station road (back entrance). Bring whatever equipment you can.


We need to clear snow away from equipment, get access to equipment and the station, and get snow off the roof of the station, trailer, and section house.


There are also lots of trees down in Phoenicia and along the ROW, so bring a chain saw.


Anyone who has a camera, please bring it and send me photos if you can. This is the largest snowfall in at least a generation at Phoenicia, and we want lots of pictures!!



Ernie Hunt
Volunteer Coordinator
CMRR
I never thought Id ever see a call for snowshoes! HAHAHA

Good luck to you guys up there digging out, I hope everyone stays safe, and there isn't much damage to equipment or buildings, and not too many trees fallen along the ROW!!! And hopefully all the snow doesn't melt at once with a warmspell and heavy rain storm!!!

I think everyone is going to have a big party when spring finally comes!
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