Amtrak now does assigned seating - oh when will they lear

carajul wrote:My trip from Orlando they had us wait outside the train until everyone got off. One at a time, the conductor asked each passenger of their final destination. He had a print out of the rail car with each seat, then told each person what seat to sit in

Mr. Carajul, I've had occasion to observe the "streetcaring" and seat assignment practices at Orlando; I confess this "non-railfan' has actually "railfanned' there at the station during my (almost) annual visits "down below'.

In short, it appears to needlessly delay trains as I doubt if the scheduled station time at Orlando provides for these practices that are in great part done for the convenience of the train crew. After all, what better way is there to protect revenue than lifting it as the passenger boards; what better way is there to ensure you don't have to answer for a "carry by" than have that seat assigned upon boarding?

Even if I personally "don't do Coach', I did just that this past December riding #3(12DEC) CHI-MDT. The Conductor lifted my ticket at a dais in front of the gate at CUS; the Attendant assigned my seat as I boarded. Did i like my Seat 68? NO. It was over the wheels and although a window, was still obstructed by a window post. But then i guess such is the "joys' of riding Coach - and it was over and done in less than two hours.

Even spoiled and pampered GBN can live with that.

Well far as I know, ARROW has the ability to do seat assignments for coach when a ticket is purchased. However the train consist data must be punched in which might be different day to day in some cases. It would probably be no problem for trains like the Cascades or the any of the trains with sleeper service (since they get assigned in advance) but I don't know about the others.

i'm a conductor on the cascades (and the builder) and i HATE the seat assignment deal but i can see why we do it. if you are getting on in vancouver, bc and going to tukwila we have to put you in car 3 and all others downline going to tukwila need to be put there too since tukwila is a short stop you don't want to have to manually open 5 doors and walk the whole length of the train.
i grew up in nyc, i'm used to taking the regionals on the corridor and all doors opening, everyone on, everyone off. it works perfectly but they have high platforms so they can do that.
and like someone else said we do it a certain way so families can sit together. again i'm used to the east where you looked for your own seat and took it, might not be with your friend but a seat is a seat.
i personally can't wait till the point defiance bypass is up and running because people get so annoying about sitting on the water side. only half the train can sit on that side, people do not understand this. ugh. anyway, enough bellyaching from me.

I did a Piedmont - Carolinian day trip from Raleigh to Greensboro back in September. On the PIedmont, I sat anywhere I wanted to. On the return trip on the Carolinian, they assigned seats which surprised me a little but I didn't thinnk much of it at the time. They said they were full all the way to Washington.

On the Carolinian we will often assign seats when the train manifest indicates that we will be full by Raleigh or Wilson heading north. Main reason is to protect some doubles for couples getting on in Wilson, Rocky Mount, Richmond, etc. Its a pain- people see empty seats and want a window-- couples get on in Petersburg, etc and complain because there are no doubles so they can sit together. Its a can't win situation for the crew. When the train's expected to be less then full, we don't bother with it. Leaving Charlotte we do block cars by destination especially since Burlington, Cary and Selma are short platforms. Washington to NY passengers will be in the first car till it over flows, usually by Wilson. We also put all the Raleigh's in one car and will have 100% turn over in that car when we hit Raleigh.

I can understand why they do it to keep families together. This isn't so much of a problem on the NEC because if you get on and the only seats available are singles all you have to do is wait for a major stop like New York or Philly where the train essentially empties and refills itself with passengers. The trick is to change seats right after the passengers get off and before more board. (I often do this in New York especially, even if I'm alone and just want a window seat.) This isn't so much the case for long distance trains. Passengers on the Silver Service in particular often ride the train straight from Florida to New York or visa versa. If there are only single seats left on the train when you board a NB train in Jesup, GA for example, it's probably going to be like that until you get to DC. I do think there's a solution for this though. You know how NE Regionals have those 4 end car seats that face each other and are often reserved for families of 3 or 4? Well implement that on long distance trains, except instead of just having a few seats and the end of the car, dedicate a whole car or two to families.

Rtrain wrote:i'm a conductor on the cascades (and the builder) and i HATE the seat assignment deal but i can see why we do it. if you are getting on in vancouver, bc and going to tukwila we have to put you in car 3 and all others downline going to tukwila need to be put there too since tukwila is a short stop you don't want to have to manually open 5 doors and walk the whole length of the train.

That's simple. For short stops or stations with short platforms just open one or two doors in the middle of the train, and before arrival gather all the passengers for that stop into that car. They did this to me in Palatka. Palatka is a short platform station. Though it can probably handle 4 doors or so they only choose to open one for convenience sake. I don't see why you need to keep everybody in the same car.

Murjax wrote:

Rtrain wrote:i'm a conductor on the cascades (and the builder) and i HATE the seat assignment deal but i can see why we do it. if you are getting on in vancouver, bc and going to tukwila we have to put you in car 3 and all others downline going to tukwila need to be put there too since tukwila is a short stop you don't want to have to manually open 5 doors and walk the whole length of the train.

That's simple. For short stops or stations with short platforms just open one or two doors in the middle of the train, and before arrival gather all the passengers for that stop into that car. They did this to me in Palatka. Palatka is a short platform station. Though it can probably handle 4 doors or so they only choose to open one for convenience sake. I don't see why you need to keep everybody in the same car.

thats what we do. the problem is we have 7 coaches. and multiple stops where we have to get people on to various specific cars. the furthest cars for portland, the closest for the shorts (tukwila, edmonds, everett). now that we have trains from vancouver, bc all the way through to portland with a crew changeover in seattle its a pain.

Rtrain wrote:

Murjax wrote:

Rtrain wrote:i'm a conductor on the cascades (and the builder) and i HATE the seat assignment deal but i can see why we do it. if you are getting on in vancouver, bc and going to tukwila we have to put you in car 3 and all others downline going to tukwila need to be put there too since tukwila is a short stop you don't want to have to manually open 5 doors and walk the whole length of the train.

That's simple. For short stops or stations with short platforms just open one or two doors in the middle of the train, and before arrival gather all the passengers for that stop into that car. They did this to me in Palatka. Palatka is a short platform station. Though it can probably handle 4 doors or so they only choose to open one for convenience sake. I don't see why you need to keep everybody in the same car.

thats what we do. the problem is we have 7 coaches. and multiple stops where we have to get people on to various specific cars. the furthest cars for portland, the closest for the shorts (tukwila, edmonds, everett). now that we have trains from vancouver, bc all the way through to portland with a crew changeover in seattle its a pain.

That's exactly why the seat assignments should be eliminated. You don't need a car for Portland or Vancouver. Those stations can support the whole length of the train and at busy stations like that all the doors should be opened.

Murjax wrote:
That's exactly why the seat assignments should be eliminated. You don't need a car for Portland or Vancouver. Those stations can support the whole length of the train and at busy stations like that all the doors should be opened.

all the doors opened at vancouver, washington? do you realize how long that would take, what if we come in on main 1? then we have to put step boxes down (and then back up) for every coach, close up and then go.
we put all the seattles in 8 and 9 leaving vancouver, bc and along the way. that way when we get to seattle those 2 cars are completely empty and the new crew can assign seats in those cars. if we just let everyone sit everywhere then every 4 seater would have 1 person spread out and all the families getting on in seattle would be crying about having to sit spread over 5 cars.

Rtrain wrote:

Murjax wrote:
That's exactly why the seat assignments should be eliminated. You don't need a car for Portland or Vancouver. Those stations can support the whole length of the train and at busy stations like that all the doors should be opened.

all the doors opened at vancouver, washington? do you realize how long that would take, what if we come in on main 1? then we have to put step boxes down (and then back up) for every coach, close up and then go.
we put all the seattles in 8 and 9 leaving vancouver, bc and along the way. that way when we get to seattle those 2 cars are completely empty and the new crew can assign seats in those cars. if we just let everyone sit everywhere then every 4 seater would have 1 person spread out and all the families getting on in seattle would be crying about having to sit spread over 5 cars.

I meant Vancouver, BC when I said you should open all the doors. I forgot there was a Vancouver, WA. Anyway as I said before I understand assigning seats so families can be together, but for everyone else it's more of a nuisance than convenience. A separate car reserved for families of 3 and more would make both happy. It might make passengers in other cars happier too. With a majority of kids in one car other people could read, sleep, or work easier.

Murjax wrote:

Rtrain wrote:

Murjax wrote:
That's exactly why the seat assignments should be eliminated. You don't need a car for Portland or Vancouver. Those stations can support the whole length of the train and at busy stations like that all the doors should be opened.

all the doors opened at vancouver, washington? do you realize how long that would take, what if we come in on main 1? then we have to put step boxes down (and then back up) for every coach, close up and then go.
we put all the seattles in 8 and 9 leaving vancouver, bc and along the way. that way when we get to seattle those 2 cars are completely empty and the new crew can assign seats in those cars. if we just let everyone sit everywhere then every 4 seater would have 1 person spread out and all the families getting on in seattle would be crying about having to sit spread over 5 cars.

I meant Vancouver, BC when I said you should open all the doors. I forgot there was a Vancouver, WA. Anyway as I said before I understand assigning seats so families can be together, but for everyone else it's more of a nuisance than convenience. A separate car reserved for families of 3 and more would make both happy. It might make passengers in other cars happier too. With a majority of kids in one car other people could read, sleep, or work easier.

oops. the joys of having a train that stops at 2 stations with the same name!

yeah but the fact that only certain cars will open at certain stations. and you can't just open a door and say find a seat cause people will be schlepping through the train with luggage, they'll walk to the last car and realize its full, then walk back to where they got on and "settle" for having to sit next to someone. or they will see an open seat and sit and get comfortable, meanwhile theres a seatcheck there and the person is just in the bathroom.
its sad but true, people need to be babysat and told what to do or it gets crazy. people whine and complain and try to avoid sitting next to someone EVERY TIME. this is public transportation folks, you are gonna have to sit next to someone. if you want to be able to smoke and spread out across 4 seats then drive your car.

Rtrain wrote: yeah but the fact that only certain cars will open at certain stations. and you can't just open a door and say find a seat cause people will be schlepping through the train with luggage, they'll walk to the last car and realize its full, then walk back to where they got on and "settle" for having to sit next to someone. or they will see an open seat and sit and get comfortable, meanwhile theres a seatcheck there and the person is just in the bathroom.

That's happened to me on the NEC when I board at Bridgeport. The good thing is though usually someone will speak up and say which car has the most seats available, usually the conductor if he sees us walking through the train just after departure. On most trains this isn't a huge issue. There's usually a few seats in each car on your average train. If the train is busy, note the car with the least number of passengers and send everyone who boards in that direction. Once again if you had a dedicated family car this would be even easier.

matthewsaggie wrote:On the Carolinian we will often assign seats when the train manifest indicates that we will be full by Raleigh or Wilson heading north. Main reason is to protect some doubles for couples getting on in Wilson, Rocky Mount, Richmond, etc. Its a pain- people see empty seats and want a window-- couples get on in Petersburg, etc and complain because there are no doubles so they can sit together. Its a can't win situation for the crew. When the train's expected to be less then full, we don't bother with it. Leaving Charlotte we do block cars by destination especially since Burlington, Cary and Selma are short platforms. Washington to NY passengers will be in the first car till it over flows, usually by Wilson. We also put all the Raleigh's in one car and will have 100% turn over in that car when we hit Raleigh.

Why is this the crews problem?

If people want to sit together, then they can ask people if they are willing to move. If not, suck it up. I've done this with my family on trains and planes.

I understand blocking an entire car, or even organizing by car to get people off at 3am, but let people deal with their own seats.

Let us be mindful at this discussion that "we" care more about where we sit on a public conveyance than does "John Q". Quite simply, John Q does not care, and if he does it is usually limited to having his party sit together. Window seats properly aligned, center car, forward riding on the 'action' (Fireman's) side, are simply not on the priority list. Therefore, having an Attendant directing the passenger to a seat in most cases is hardly the "big deal' that it is to many here.

I can think of an instance about a year ago involving myself but on a KPBI-KORD flight. After establishing from American's site, the aircraft was to be an MD-88, and from those seats they were offering this four trips nine flights during '09 "infrequent flyer' (and not even in AAdvantage - their mileage rewards plan), I selected one aft of the wing yet forward of the engine so as to maximize flightseeing should the day be clear. Since I had no need for overhead luggage space (my over the shoulder flight bag fits quite nicely under the seat), I did not board until some 15' before scheduled departure (remember they can leave 10min early at Captain's discretion). When i boarded someone asked me if he could have the seat as his wife was in the center of my row - and his seat while window was obstructed by the #2 engine. i think I was tactful (I defer to those around here who know me face to face to decide if that is even possible), but i said I wanted that seat (flightseeing was 'great' all the way; "picking off' all the landmarks on a flight i have made umpteen times over the years) and that was that.

I'm sure the guy asked me in good faith, but especially when I learned they were traveling on reward points, i did not feel any obligation whatever to change.

Relating this matter reminds me of a 1969 fan trip GCT to Hyannis (Mr. Weaver, weren't you on there as well?) in which the sponsors had chartered Bunker Hill - a Tavern-obs. Although mid-train leaving GCT, it was rear car properly pointed East of NH. Well guess what, two older women, obviously not fans, staked out the obs seats - and promptly went to sleep. GGGGRRRRR!!!

Mr. Norman, I think this is the first time you have said "grrrrrr" in this fourm.

I think the best solution here since most trains are reserved these days, go ahead and do seat assignment upon reservation.