NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

trainbrain wrote:The cab car is stuck where it is now. Can't really pull it out or get a crane to lift it out. How would that be done?
The other 3 cars and the engine are still on the rails and would probably just be pulled out by another locomotive.

time wrote:3. Back a tow truck down the tracks, assuming there is a tow truck in this world that could tug that much weight.

If this was on a freight railroad, they'd just use a locomotive to pull it back onto the rails, possibly after removing the remains of the bumper.

All of the damaged trainshed and concourse skylights have to be removed first,by using airbags as a support,
pull the cab car away from the wall and back on the track and on the front truck.
It will take time to repair what can be repaired,then reconstruction of the track 5,4,and 6 trainshed sections can begin.
Figure on a few more weeks of basic cleanup/repair to to make the concourse/station building safe for use.

time wrote:

trainbrain wrote:The cab car is stuck where it is now. Can't really pull it out or get a crane to lift it out. How would that be done?

The other 3 cars and the engine are still on the rails and would probably just be pulled out by another locomotive.

I was wondering the same, and came up with three armchair options:

1. Set up a portable crane outside of the terminal that can span the distance and lift at least half of the car at a time, get it back on the rails, while using a locomotive to pull it down the track. Honestly, I'm not even sure there is a crane in this world that could do that, just theorizing.

2. Remove additional sections of the roof either in back of or adjacent to the cab car and use a crane on a railcar to move it back on the rails.

3. Back a tow truck down the tracks, and use boards to adjust the car back on the track while the tow truck pulls on the car. That's assuming there is a tow truck in this world that could tug that much weight.

Depending on how much of the bumper block remains (which can be torched or jackhammered off) and whether or not the leading truck of the cab car is still intact or railworthy, they may just be able to pull the car back and use jacks and blocks to rerail the cab car. I would think that they would want to keep as much of it intact as possible so the legal eagles can all have their day.

JimBoylan wrote:

trainbrain wrote:The cab car is stuck where it is now. Can't really pull it out or get a crane to lift it out. How would that be done?
The other 3 cars and the engine are still on the rails and would probably just be pulled out by another locomotive.

time wrote:3. Back a tow truck down the tracks, assuming there is a tow truck in this world that could tug that much weight.

If this was on a freight railroad, they'd just use a locomotive to pull it back onto the rails, possibly after removing the remains of the bumper.

How would they couple that with the back end being lower than it should be? I guess the question becomes if it became decoupled, and if not, perhaps they could just pull it back after removing anything resting on the car or hung up underneath.

With tightlock couplers, it may very well still be coupled to the next car. They could just leave the second car attached and pull them out together.

People seem to have some misconceptions about PTC. One of the most common was addressed by some of the NTSB people at one of the recent press conferences following the Hoboken derailment. When asked if PTC systems could prevent an accident like this they mentioned that the PTC systems currently being phased in on U.S. rail systems is not new technology. They're new to the United States but the same basic systems have been in use in Europe and Asia for upwards of forty years. For instance, Amtrak's ACSES, a transponder-based PTC system installed along the NEC fifteen years ago, was based on Swedish technology. Today's PTC systems use GPS not transponders but again, that is not new either, except in the U.S.

ACSES, a transponder based system, is derived from a system originally developed in Sweden, and used for many years in France and Belgium. Link

NJT now requiring two crew members to pull into Hoboken?

"NJ Transit has issued new instructions to its rail employees requiring that two members of the train crew must be in the front car of every train pulling into Hoboken....The train’s conductor must join the engineer at the front of the train “to focus exclusively on the railroad, calling signal, checking the route and ensuring that the train is operated safely in compliance with all rules and restrictions,”"
http://www.northjersey.com/news/after-c ... -1.1671925

Applies to Hoboken as well as Atlantic City. Conductor expected to move up to the cab/engine

"...bulletin says the “conductor and the engineer are to focus exclusively on the railroad, calling signal, checking the route and ensuring that the train is operated safely in compliance.”"
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/06/nyreg ... ation.html

Well, looks like I guessed right on that in another forum last week... I had a feeling that would be the first thing to come out of this and said so in that conversation.

If the car's frame got bent while going over the block, might it be best to just scrap it on the spot?

You can't scrap it until the legal beagles are done with it.

Does NJT generally have locomotives on the south/west end?

For diesel trains going to Hoboken, locomotive is on the west end. Inbounds are led by the cab car and outbounds by the locomotive.

Don't they still run certain trains engine first into Hoboken during the colder months?

If like the Raritan Valley line, one set is reversed for snow clearing. Even runs as an extra throughout a snowy night if required. Suspect the other lines each have a similar protocol.

Fair use quote: "A New Jersey Transit train that crashed into Hoboken's terminal last week, killing one person and injuring more than 100 others, was going twice the speed limit at the moment of impact, and the train's engineer hit the emergency brake less than a second before the crash, federal investigators said Thursday.

The National Transportation Safety Board said the findings were gleaned from data recorders aboard the train.

The speed limit for the station area is 10 mph."

Link to press report: http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2016 ... iver_index