Daily News: Rt. 15 Trolleys will roll in September

http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/new ... 953493.htm

It seems that the recent series in the Daily News got results.

Let's give thanks to the paper for getting the politicians off their lazy, fat butts to get the cars rolling.

About time!

The silly thing is, I bet in the end, SEPTA will find the operating costs to be less than a bus, too. And, riding the PCCIIs will be a treat. They sure did their money out of the PCCs.

Ok - I'll take a WAG here, but are the PCCs the oldest (regularly) operating passenger rail equipment in the US? I can't think of anything close (unless New Orleans runs older cars on their system still? Or MUNI's cable cars?)

The cable cars and the NO Witts are older.

I'll believe it when I see it....

I already heard everyone downtown (at 1234) coming up with possible issues that will prevent service:

Most of the cars have not been "excersized" over the past year, the ones that have run on charters have been the same ones.

Lehigh ave still needs wire restrung, but each time it goes up it lasts about 2 weeks

I too will believe it when I see it

Philadelphia's PCC fleet was acquired between 1938 ( the first 20 Air-Electric Cars) and 1947 ( the All Electric Cars out of which the present fleet of PCCII's was "created") with some 2nd hand cars acquired in 1955-56-- most notably the ex Kansas City Cars which were all-electric cars almost identical to the 1947 cars except that they had a modified body---- large side windows and no standee windows.

As has been indicated above, the New Orleans conventional cars, built circa 1924, and the SF Cable Cars are much older than the Philadelphia PCC's.

I don't care if they're oldest... I don't care if they're newest... I don't care if they're fastest... I don't care if they're the most comfortable...

All I care about is that they RUN!

walt wrote:Philadelphia's PCC fleet was acquired between 1938 ( the first 20 Air-Electric Cars) and 1947 ( the All Electric Cars out of which the present fleet of PCCII's was "created") with some 2nd hand cars acquired in 1955-56-- most notably the ex Kansas City Cars which were all-electric cars almost identical to the 1947 cars except that they had a modified body---- large side windows and no standee windows.

As has been indicated above, the New Orleans conventional cars, built circa 1924, and the SF Cable Cars are much older than the Philadelphia PCC's.

One thing about PCC cars---- they DO run-- and run-----and run. That's why they've lasted as long as they have.

Hey everybody,

Long time listener, first time caller.

I was very glad to see the chain of events initiated by the Daily News; kudos to the paper and especially to the “Urban Warrior”.

I have been very interested in the return of the Route 15 trolleys; not only as an advocate of rail transportation, but as a resident served by this Route. Like some of the responses above, I will believe it when I see it.

When I opened yesterday’s paper and saw the article, I was elated. As I kept on reading, the feeling subsided. Although the major issue of getting the city leadership to wake up and actually use their dormant brains to address a major hot issue, I still see some problems.

Idle time: As mentioned above, majority of the PCC II’s have been sitting in a yard for a year collecting dust. Anyone with decent mechanical knowledge knows this is bad.

Port Richmond Bridge: The wires in both directions are tied off and half the wire guides in the bridge have been ripped down. Even though fixing the wires should take minimum time and money, I forecast this will be an ongoing problem, worse then the parking situation on 59th street. SEPTA has installed huge red signs accompanied by strobe lights warning of the low clearance. Even with these warnings, trucks hitting the bridge are frequent enough to hinder service. Very scary that there are some people driving huge trucks that are either illiterate or have an IQ of a mud pie. Even though there is a short loop at Cumberland, SEPTA does not have the initiative or crisis skills to run the trolleys to the loop and use a shuttle bus for the rest of the trip. They will probably run busses the whole route until the wires are fixed. As everyone knows, the time to fix the wires could span one day to 13 years.

Traffic patterns: I’m a bit scared on this one. As the 59th street parkers displayed, it is easier to forget the trolleys then adapt to them when reinstated. There will be many “rude awakenings” on Girard Ave and Richmond St. when the trolleys run. Luckily Girard is wide enough that double parkers will not be a problem (Richmond might be a problem though). Yes there will be a learning curve and time will be needed for all to adjust. In the mean time, I just hope no one gets run over exiting a trolley.

In the article, SEPTA mentioned that it will take three months to assign operators. I know it takes time to assign and instruct operators, but three months? It is a good chance that they are just waiting for the fall schedule change, but why didn’t they just say that? I think this was SEPTA’s spin statement hiding the fact that as usual, they were caught with their pants down.

Oh well, I’ll keep my eyes open in September…..

the sarge

I share your concerns as a rider too Sarge.....having trolleys running late for most of us means missing a connection to the MFL, BSL or even worse a train that runs once an hour downtown. Would definitely be a disaster for me.

With the trolleys discharging passengers on Richmond St between Girard and Lehigh, I'm hoping drivers have the common sense not to pass the trolley on the right, as a trolley can't pull curbside to let people off.

Alot of businesses on Richmond St also receive large shipments via truck during the week, with the truck blocking one lane of traffic for up to a half hour. I don't know how this is going to be resolved, at least in a way to keep everyone happy. In either case, there will be growing pains for everyone. I'm just hoping as a rider that the disruptions will be addressed as they occur to avoid repeat.

Hopefully after a few weeks it will become routine, and our fight isn't over my friends----we need write the papers after the 15 starts running and boast how wonderful the service is over buses. We need to get the word out that this is the way to travel in the city---let's get the 23 and 56 moving too! I know pipe dream, but this is a start.

Richmond St will be the Achilles heel of the route 15 trolley, especially for traffic clearance, the bridge, and disembarking passengers. I cannot tell you how many times I've seen the Route 15 bus on Lehigh Ave because of incidents / delivery trucks on Richmond St.

Majority of city resident know not to pass a trolley on the right when stopped, just like majority of truck drivers know the clearance limit of their rigs. But like the bridge incidents, it only takes on ignorant idiot to cause a mess. At least the PCC II’s do have bright stop signs that light up for passenger stops, just hope all heed the warnings.

If all goes as planned, the next article written about Route 15 in the Daily News should be reporting on the inaugural run a of a revenue service PCC II. After that articel, I hope to see a follow up on the success of the line, not one reporting about a school child being hit at a stop.

the sarge

Don't worry about the cars sitting idle. They will all be out on training runs for the operators need to be requalified on the cars since their 1 year qualification hs since expired.

Actually many drivers are too stupid to realize they shouldn't pass a trolley on the right. I've ridden the 34 many times down Baltimore Ave, and you get these morons that shoot around on the right side of the trolley because they're about to make a right turn. Meanwhile passengers are stepping out the center doors. Bad combination.

Also, notice the 10 runs in the left hand lanes of 63rd St (anybody care to explain why they did that?). At every stop there are large flashing lights and a sign I beleive warning drivers in the right lane to stop.

Joe

If my memory serves me correctly, 63rd St wasn't always that wide. Also the 10 is almost 100 years old and back then all trolley lines were built in the center of the road.

Another thing that's hard to believe...that this image of PCC-IIs testing on Girard is over a year old.