All Things Portal Bridge: Amtrak and NJT Status and Replacement Discussion

Wow, thank goodness I didnt have to come into NYP today. Mr Jervis its not just Portal, its the entire NEC. You shouldve seen the TSRB(temporary speed restriction bulletin) this past Friday. Loaded with speed restriction up and down. It was the worst between Philly and DC with alot of the slow downs being at the interlockings.

Portal Bridge was still a problem for the evening rush hour traffic out of NY Penn Station. Seemed like they were still single tracking it (and that was around 7 p.m. this evening). Hopefully they will have this fixed by tomorrow's a.m. rush hour.

BuddSilverliner269 wrote:Wow, thank goodness I didnt have to come into NYP today. Mr Jervis its not just Portal, its the entire NEC. You shouldve seen the TSRB(temporary speed restriction bulletin) this past Friday. Loaded with speed restriction up and down. It was the worst between Philly and DC with alot of the slow downs being at the interlockings.

I agree, but PORTAL is located in a position where it affects more than Amtrak's NEC and the commuter railroads which run on it. Dozens of NJT trains from other lines cross it via the Kearney interlocking. It may be the most critically important stretch of track in the entire United States passanger system.

amtrakhogger wrote:Early this morning around 6am, a track inspector discovered a rail defect on #2 track on Portal bridge. The track inspector immediately slapped a 15 mph restriction for all moves across the bridge. The restriction has been in place all day.

And what a sight it was, to see Amtrak and NJT trains lined up back to back (I counted a total of 9) headed towards Penn Tuesday morning around 11 AM.

Port Jervis wrote:I agree, but PORTAL is located in a position where it affects more than Amtrak's NEC and the commuter railroads which run on it. Dozens of NJT trains from other lines cross it via the Kearney interlocking. It may be the most critically important stretch of track in the entire United States passanger system.

I counted it a few years ago in the NJTs Newark Division employee timetable (which shows all movements, even Amtrak trains) and inbetween Swift interlocking, where the MandE comes up and meets up with the NEC and A interlocking, which is at the mouth of the North River tunnels in NYP and it was well over 500 trains. That number is probably a little higher now.

500 plus trains on 2 tracks. yea, id say its important! hahahah

According to the NYTimes, the FRA has approved the Portal Bridge Project. They are also reporting that it will be done by 2014. Unlike ARC, I am a big fan of anything to replace the infrastructure disaster that is Portal. Also, I pray to god that the overhaul of Swift will result in faster speeds from the M&E to the NEC.

Here's the link to the article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/01/nyreg ... f=nyregion

And here's the article text:

Approval Given for New Jersey Rail Bridges

By KEN BELSON
Published: December 31, 2008

In a move that could unlock one of the thorniest railroad bottlenecks in the Northeast, the Federal Railroad Administration on Wednesday signed off on a plan to replace the almost century-old Portal Bridge that spans the Hackensack River.

The administration approved the final environmental impact statement that clears the way for Amtrak to spend $1.34 billion to build a three-track bridge just north of the Portal Bridge and a two-track span south of the bridge. The project is expected to be completed by 2014. Once the new bridges are finished, the Portal Bridge, built in 1910, will be dismantled.

Even the slightest slowdown can interfere with the daily routines of the approximately 150,000 New Jersey Transit passengers who cross the bridge each weekday. Nearly 400 New Jersey Transit trains and 103 Amtrak trains use the bridge daily. Because of its structure, trains can travel only 60 miles per hour on the bridge, compared with 90 miles per hour on tracks nearby.

The 961-foot Portal Bridge, which sits on a turntable, has only two tracks. And because its lowest beams are only 23 feet above the river, the bridge must swing open almost daily to allow commercial boats to pass. That delays trains traveling between Pennsylvania Station in Manhattan and all points west during nonpeak hours on average about 20 minutes.

Amtrak, which owns and operates the bridge, also spends millions of dollars each year to keep it working. In 2005, for instance, the railroad spent nearly $5 million to repair damage caused by a fire at the bridge, which connects Secaucus and Kearny, N.J., on the Northeast Corridor line.

Richard R. Sarles, executive director of New Jersey Transit, said the new northern bridge will be high enough that all maritime traffic will clear it, adding, “Maybe a handful of boats will necessitate the southern bridge to open a few times a year.”

Mr. Sarles said that the two bridges were designed to line up with tracks leading to the new rail tunnel under the Hudson River that New Jersey Transit and the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey are planning. The tunnel is expected to cost nearly $9 billion, but the authority is still seeking about $3 billion in federal financing.

Once the new bridges and tunnel are completed, New Jersey Transit will be able to add more trains on the Morris and Essex, North Jersey Coast and Raritan Valley lines.

The projects will also mean that passengers on the Main Line, Bergen County Line, Pascack Valley Line and Port Jervis Line will no longer have to transfer at Secaucus Junction to get to Penn Station in Manhattan.

jumsmuj wrote: I am a big fan of anything to replace the infrastructure disaster that is Portal

Kinda didn't help that NJ Transit started abusing the structure when it was 86 years old.

PullmanCo wrote:

jumsmuj wrote: I am a big fan of anything to replace the infrastructure disaster that is Portal

Kinda didn't help that NJ Transit started abusing the structure when it was 86 years old.

Thats a great point..........

gotta wonder where we would be right now if Midtown Direct was never implemented, and instead the focus was on routing more Newark Division trains to Hoboken via an expanded Waterfront Connection.

Talk about being a victim of your own success!!!

I wonder what the planners of Midtown Direct thought the service would be like in 10-13 years like it is now, and the problems we are now facing, or if it was ever even considered or forseen.

I personally think that the overwhelming success of Midtown Direct has made NJT VERY cautious on heavy rail system expansion projects, and which is one of the reasons why MOM and West Trenton, etc are taking seemingly several lifetimes to get anything done.

Jtgshu wrote:I personally think that the overwhelming success of Midtown Direct has made NJT VERY cautious on heavy rail system expansion projects, and which is one of the reasons why MOM and West Trenton, etc are taking seemingly several lifetimes to get anything done.

I'd say that's pretty accurate, at least in the case of MOM. At projected ARC service levels on the NEC and NJCL, it's nearly impossible to slot in a MOM train during the AM Peak. There were a few designs floating around when I was still working on that project that would have put in a high-speed "flying" connection at Monmouth Junction, but you'd still be hard-pressed to squeeze a few more slots for MOM during the two peak-of-the-peak hours. The NJCL alternatives wouldn't be much better, if at all.

Planning ANYTHING based on that foolishness they call a "plan" for the tunnel under the Hudson is misguided. Build both bridges fixed at the same height, and add two more tunnels to the same station we've already got. Making this bridge project needlessly complex exclusively to support a tunnel plan which hopefully will never see the light of day is just a waste of our money.

Presently the right-of-way around Portal Bridge allows for 90 mph speeds. (The bridge itself is 60 mph.) My question is, with the curves and turnouts required in the new configuration, will through trains still be able to maintain 90 mph in this territory? Or is Amtrak trading faster speeds for reliability?

As published yesterday in the New York Times, Amtrak and NJ transit will build two bridges simultaneously, a three-track fixed bridge a little north of Portal, and a two-track movable bridge south of Portal. The westbound track on the southbound bridge will "duck under" the alignment leading from the northern bridge to the M&E lines. The whole thing should be done by 2014, wherein Portal will be dismantled.

The Portal Bridge website has a library that includes the final Environmental Impact Statement that the FRA approved on December 31st. Issue Three (pdf) of the Portal Bridge Newsletter has a summary of why this alternative was chosen.

My question, which I also posed in the NJT forum thread on the subject, is this: presently the right-of-way around Portal Bridge allows for 90 mph speeds. (The bridge itself is 60 mph.) But with the curves and turnouts required in the new configuration, will through trains still be able to maintain 90 mph in this territory? Or is Amtrak trading faster speeds for reliability?

Amtrak needs to get tough with NJT in that the new downtown terminal needs to be well connected to Penn Station and, ideally, Sunnyside yard so that Amtrak can use the new station if there is a problem with the North River Tubes. NJT might be able to ignore common sense and *ARPs, but why should Amtrak disrupt its own operations for little in return.

What is the problem with the PORTAL bridge anyway. I know its 60mph, but is this due to the structure or the foundations. A clever option would be to build new foundations and float the old bridge structure over onto them. Reduce, reuse, recycle, I always say.

And why exactly should NJT listen to Amtrak? I agree with you this makes sense, but what's the value to NJT?

The fact that Amtrak owns the NEC. Thats why NJT should listen if there should be continued co-operation. Ever since Swift was built and the M&E Midtown Direct trains started using the High Line to get to Penn Station, train traffic is at a stand still during rush hour. Its because of NJT that many Amtrak trains get slowed down. I run 2122 from DC to NYC and we follow a NJT train from Swift to NYC. This NJT train makes Secaucus and theres other tracks at this station and we watch them load and unload and follow them into the tunnel. Of course that blame lays with dispatching as well.I agree the new Penn Station should be for everyones use, not NJT. There would be no interconnectivity if they dont and then , whats the point? If theres no connectivity between NJT and Amtrak, then why should Amtrak allow them to choke the NEC