Why not electric NYP to Huntington?

Have been watching (read savoring) one of my Christmas gifts; a cab ride between NYP and Port Jefferson. The train in the video was #660 on 08.31.95.
The naration indicates the power unit, an FL9, used the third rail electric current in NYP and the tunnel leading to Long Island City; where it switched to diesel power for the remainder of the trip.

Why would it not use third rail current to Huntington and then switch to diesel?

Thanks
Best regards,
Rodger

The DE30's are so unreliable on third rail that the Railroad minimizes their electric use.

Clem

Clem:

I believe he's asking why the FL9 in his video didn't run on electric all the way to Huntington in lieu of switching to diesel after leaving the tunnels.

Dave

The FL9's were just as unreliable.

Thanks Dave, for clarifying that. I read too carelessly.

Mr. M7's correct, the FL9's also gave lots of trouble in electric mode, and the Railroad wished to avoid the unpleasantries of having the stuff broken down or gapped in Jay or Hall or Nassau.

They learned this the hard way.

Clem

From the beginning, the FL9's were not designed to operate off of electric mode for a whole trip. They were only designed to get the trains out of the Park Avenue Tunnel (and later, Penn Station).

Jay

Clem

You are so right about jamming up Jay,Hall and Nassau. However dont jam up Harold either because then the rush hour is SHOT!

Coming westbound the LIRR wants the DE30s turned over to e-mode before you get to Nassau. When I run them (rarely thank God) I like to be in both Diesel and e-mode and then go to complete e-mode right after Mineola station.
I particularly don't like when coming thru the tunnels, if you know a 15 code is coming up you better be at about 12mph, because if you get penalized for an over speed, the train's speed is dropped to about 8mph and then you just gapped Penn Station.

Eastbound they want you to go to diesel mode right after Harold, while passing thru Woodside. Sometimes if you get a long enough stop signal in F or Harold while waiting for an Amtrak to pass in front of you you can go to e-mode right there.

They current picked up by the East unit does not transfer through the train to the West unit to avoid gapping?

and if you gap in Penn can you go to diesel to get out of the gap or do you need to call the protects.

I think management's strategy to get into the second mode as soon as possible. That way if there is a problem with the second mode it will be detected early, so that some measures can be taken to protect the schedule. If you wait til the last moment to change to diesel, and the diesel doesn't work, the train has to stop at Huntington and clog the tracks. If you change to diesel at Harold, and it does not work, the train can continue in electric. 204 can have MofE meet the train at Jamaica, and possibly fix the problem on the way east. Meanwhile, 204 can be working on contingencies if the problem isn't fixed, perhaps the equipment for 668 can take passengers east of Huntington, and 668's equipment will be replaced. Similar concept for westbound traffic.

3 and 1/2 years ago I was on train 658 when it crapped out in Line 3 (511 leading). Either they had to get the protect engines, or start the diesels up, and sure enough they started the diesels up before it got out of the tunnels. Due to a computer malfunction, both engines overheated causing that train to cancel at Jamaica where it couldn't go above 30 MPH, and again the train crapped out at Jay where the train had to coast into the station where it stopped just short of Jamaica, and they finally started the diesels up so they can let the passengers out. And I went onto 660 which was packed like a sardine can until Huntington.

They current picked up by the East unit does not transfer through the train to the West unit to avoid gapping?

From this post, we have decided that you are asking whether the high-voltage is trainlined from the west to east engines?

If so, the answer is no it is not. Modern equipment can nolonger have more than 480 volts between non-permanently coupled cars. If the third rail power was trainlined on the dual-mode or MU trains, it would be way in excess of that amount (480 volts).

Only the HEP can be jumpered between cars, no traction or high voltage otherwise unless cars are permanently coupled. only power traveling between cars other than married pairs is battery/control voltage at max of 64 volt.
The Dual modes are and were not ment to run at high speed in electric.
because of their short lenght in comparison to a pair of M series cars the locomotive will arch to much when running at speed and this arching may cause flashover to engine components such as trucks or wheels.

thanks guys,

I wanted too clear it up weahther the east unit can power the lead unit while gapped going into penn on Emode if, so i guess the answer is no.

I don't believe the rear unit sends current to the lead unit, but I do believe it is controlled by the lead unit. Otherwise, there would be no purpose in requiring two units per train. If the rear unit sent current to the lead unit, the rear unit would not be necessary (I think) because then the rr could merely have pickup shoes on the coaches to provide current.

The reason for the locations picked to swith from diesel to electric (WB) and electric to diesel (EB) is that if there was a problem, the most heavily depended upon employee on the LIRR to keep trains running; The ROAD FOREMAN, could save the day at Jamaica.