The East Side Access Project Discussion (ESA)

one has no effect on other so why would they be coordinated.

DutchRailnut wrote:one has no effect on other so why would they be coordinated.

Because the Harold outage is occurring at the same time as tracks in West Side Yard are being taken down for the Amtrak's tunnel box... Thus, fewer trains will be able to be stored in Midtown, Manhattan...

Speaking of large infrastructure projects, though, what is the difference between a Major Investment Study and Feasibility Analysis?

The projects are still unrelated. The Amtrak project is merely impacting the maintenance and inspection facilities in the southeast corner of the yard...no train storage tracks will be impacted. The HAROLD work is only going to take 3-4 weeks.

Thomas wrote: ...
Speaking of large infrastructure projects, though, what is the difference between a Major Investment Study and Feasibility Analysis?

A Major Investment Study for a transportation project involves "local governments, planners and project sponsors [who] explore and analyze alternatives that can improve mobility and safety where the proposed improvement is located." Link

Once they settle on the preferred design a feasibility analysis looks at legal, economic, technological and scheduling factors to give project managers an idea of the possible negative and positive outcomes of the project. The feasibility analysis may turn up problems that require changes to the project. If possible the planners would then select an alternative that was outlined in the MIS. Link

Tommy Meehan wrote:A Major Investment Study for a transportation project involves "local governments, planners and project sponsors [who] explore and analyze alternatives that can improve mobility and safety where the proposed improvement is located." Link

Once they settle on the preferred design a feasibility analysis looks at legal, economic, technological and scheduling factors to give project managers an idea of the possible negative and positive outcomes of the project. The feasibility analysis may turn up problems that require changes to the project. If possible the planners would then select an alternative that was outlined in the MIS. Link

Does preliminary engineering come right after the feasibility analysis?

Only if the next phase is approved. Major Investment Studies are pretty weak and should be skipped. Enough effort to confirm the concept is feasible, but not in-depth enough to determine the true costs.

jlr3266 wrote:Only if the next phase is approved. Major Investment Studies are pretty weak and should be skipped. Enough effort to confirm the concept is feasible, but not in-depth enough to determine the true costs.

1.How long did it take the MTA (or engineering contractors) to complete the engineering and environmental studies for East Side Access?

2. So if Amtrak claims that they are studying the System Level Design for the Gateway Project, does that mean that preliminary engineering is next?

I'm curious to hear how Day 1 went of the peak train cancellations for those of us who commute in.

Since 2703 was shortened to Jamaica, I ended up taking 613 to Hunterspoint Ave. which was standing room only both east and west of Jamaica in my car. They held us in Jamaica for about 7 minutes as more and more people piled on. It's going to be a long and sweaty 4 weeks!

I took 2705 in from home today, but will very likely be cramming onto train 613 with you tomorrow, Mr. Jetset!

Amtrak7 put together a wonderful piece analyzing the riderships of the canceled trains and their alternatives, you can read it here: Ridership Analysis: Cancelled Summer Trains and Their Alternatives.

I did read through yesterday and enjoyed it very much! However I was disappointed with the lack of data for our normal train 2703. In my experience today, 613 had much more than a 60% load considering all seats were taken in my car with standees in the vestibules. Yours truly walked up and down one car east of Jamaica looking for a seat and couldn't even find an empty facing seat. I snagged one in Jamaica when the Penn transfers got off. If I could offer some advice for you tomorrow, transfer to 613 in Hicksville or Mineola... you'll have a better shot of getting a seat than if you wait until Jamaica!

Note one of the key notes on top of my analysis: summer ridership and consist variances aren't accounted for.

2703 was probably fuller than usual with Hamptons returns. (Last summer when I took it a handful of times I never got a seat at Hicksville on Mondays when I could get one most other days)
613 is scheduled for 6 cars. I've seen it many times during the summer with 4 or 5 cars.

Add the two together and you'll definitely get crowding.

And I guessed right that the Port Washington cancellation in the morning wouldn't be smooth, the LIRR is adding a Bayside stop to 425 from tomorrow on.

Hmmm, if only the LIRR had a completely separate, two-track branch of some sort other than the mainline west of Jamaica that they can reroute the affected diesel trains to Long Island City over instead of canceling them at Jamaica and loading the passengers onto already crowded trains...

If only such a route existed...

lirr42 wrote:Hmmm, if only the LIRR had a completely separate, two-track branch of some sort other than the mainline west of Jamaica that they can reroute the affected diesel trains to Long Island City over instead of canceling them at Jamaica and loading the passengers onto already crowded trains...

If only such a route existed...

Practically nobody wants/wanted to go to LIC, everyone wants HPA. That's why 507 only had 20.

I know but if the only options are either going to Long Island City or getting tossed off at Jamaica and having to cram onto 613 and legenthening your commute by 15 minutes I think a sufficient amount of people would go to Long Island City for the sake of keeping their seat.

The LIRR recommends that passengers shit to train 2019, the 6:56am from Ronkonkoma departure (to Atlantic Terminal).

You should probably spell check before posting. :D

Edit: I guess the forum censors out that word, but you get the idea.