Signals

I posted this over on the BNSF board, but new tri-color signals are now online at Western Springs and west of Brainard St. in LaGrange. A new eastbound signal bridge also recently went online at Highlands interlocking. The entire line now has new signals from Highlands to Union "A" interlocking.

New/upgraded signals have also gone up along the MILW-W, NCS, and SWS. Do these lines also use four-aspect block signaling?

Not sure about SWS and MILW-W, but north of B-12, NCS uses three-aspect signaling...

MD-W uses three-aspect signals west of B-12 (or is it B-17?) and four-aspect signals between there and Chicago.

Like NCS, SWS also uses three-aspect signaling.

I must respectfully disagree about signalling on the CN / NCS. Block signals can present four indications: permissive or stop-and-proceed / sorry not sure specific rule (RED), approach (YELLOW), advance approach (FLASHING YELLOW), and clear (GREEN). Approach signals to interlockings may also display approach diverging (YELLOW over GREEN), approach restricting (YELLOW over FLASHING RED), or advance approach diverging (FLASHING YELLOW over GREEN).

I live in Grayslake and see this stuff all the time...

The first page describing CN signal indications in my CORA (Chicago Operating Rules Association) guide showed three aspects (all for the diverging clear indications), but had I bothered to flip the page, I would've seen the four possible aspects matching the signal indications you mentioned. I stand corrected, thanks...

Found this online. Comes from a BNSF timetable. With the new signals going up, I think some of the signal aspects associated with diverging routes will be seen more frequently.

http://www.bnsf.com/ttc/Timetable/pdfs/ ... r_2005.pdf

Signals along SWS and RI don't make sense to me...maybe someone, bones?, could explain. I notice there is a lack of approach medium...with a few expections on SWS between 153rd and 179th. Other wise a clear goes right to approach. Any reason for this?

I can't speak specifically to RI/SWS practice, however if the block length and train stopping distances are sufficient, the flashing yellow (advance approach on Metra/UP/CN - approach medium on BNSF) is not used.

Another interesting observation regarding BNSF practice with the new signals: I believe the new high speed crossovers are 50 mph - maybe someone can confirm. I have seen the advance signal for that crossover to be "advance approach" - yellow over green in BNSF rules. If the crossover is "diverging approach" - red over yellow - then the advance signal shows double yellow "approach medium". What is happening is that BNSF is employing a mixed speed signal / route signalling practice. Although a bit confusing it actually makes sense and allows for the fastest movement of trains across those short blocks...

czyzewc wrote:I can't speak specifically to RI/SWS practice, however if the block length and train stopping distances are sufficient, the flashing yellow (advance approach on Metra/UP/CN - approach medium on BNSF) is not used.

Another interesting observation regarding BNSF practice with the new signals: I believe the new high speed crossovers are 50 mph - maybe someone can confirm. I have seen the advance signal for that crossover to be "advance approach" - yellow over green in BNSF rules. If the crossover is "diverging approach" - red over yellow - then the advance signal shows double yellow "approach medium". What is happening is that BNSF is employing a mixed speed signal / route signalling practice. Although a bit confusing it actually makes sense and allows for the fastest movement of trains across those short blocks...

The crossovers that are good for 50mph are at Lisle and from track 1 to 2 at Berwyn. Yesterday afternoon on a westbound, we took the Lisle crossover from track 2 to 3, probably at a good 45mph. I've also seen the advance approach (yellow over green) on an eastbound in advance of the Lisle crossovers. I don't know if the new crossovers at Congress Park/Maple Ave. interlocking are good for 50mph.

Look closely at this picture. This was taken last year in LaGrange. In the distance, you can see a yellow over green signal aspect for the approaching train (Note: I did not take this picture).

That's a great photo! What's more disturbing is that apparently this is an express on the center track, yet the gate is not fully down yet as the train is entering the GX ... ?

The train is most likely a mid-day local considering it is only a 5 car train. Trains frequently run on the center track when track work prevents trains from running on the usual.

Yep, def a mid day local using the center track. Its intresting, even though this has nothing to do with this topic but you can regulary see Metra trains go through the crossing with gates up at Elmhurst. The last weekday outbound of the night goes through the Prospect Ave. crossing before the gates are close to be down after it stops at the station. Also, in the past, I have seen inbounds cross York St. with the gates not fully down. This, however hasnet happened in awhile

Noticed more "signal problem" delays on BNSF this evening as posted on the service updates portion of Metra's website, with trains in both directions running 10-15 minutes late enroute, according to Metra. Lately, this seems to be a twice-weekly occurence on average, and the cutover to the new signals at Western Springs and LaGrange could be a reason... but because it's happening so frequently, I suspect BNSF could be having additional ongoing issues with these signals. Anyone know for sure?

doepack wrote:Noticed more "signal problem" delays on BNSF this evening as posted on the service updates portion of Metra's website, with trains in both directions running 10-15 minutes late enroute, according to Metra. Lately, this seems to be a twice-weekly occurence on average, and the cutover to the new signals at Western Springs and LaGrange could be a reason... but because it's happening so frequently, I suspect BNSF could be having additional ongoing issues with these signals. Anyone know for sure?

I noticed that train #1267 arrived in Naperville about 5 minutes late Thursday afternoon, but freight interference was the culprit at 3 different locations: west side of Chicago, between Cicero "A" and Clyde, and Naperville. However, we had to travel at restricted speed between Cicero "B" and LaVergne before crossing over to the center track.

With the new signals online, I think there are some small bugs that have to be worked out before they can operate problem free.