Siemens Venture Single Level Cars for CA/IL/Midwest

EDIT: post moved to Nippon Sharyo forum.

Arlington wrote:That's the problem with pop-up manufacturing: the pop-down.

And it's not a surprise. How many times have we seen a city award a contract based on, among other things, local workforce? Then the plant disappears after the order(s) are fulfilled. There's a few plants in South Chicago and Yonkers that have been owned by multiple carbuilders now. Here's an interesting bet - how long do the Chinese hold on to the Hegewisch subway car plant being built after the order is finished? Nobody builds anything in Chicago anymore.

Or Philadelphia:

Hyundai Rotem will write the final chapter of an unhappy Philadelphia story when it closes its railcar plant later this month.

Counterpoint: what if the Traveling Circus model is the problem? Some things carry across trades without a problem, but I’m not sure how much carries over from auto assembly, construction, metal fabrication, computer tech, or any number of specialized trades when you’re working on a passenger railroad car with at least three voltage standards (440VAC, 110VAC, 74VDC), all-stainless steel construction (which doesn’t happen anywhere else), and duty cycles of 2 million miles.

Maybe a plant that is willing to set down roots would render a better product.

In a where TAs are flogging ancient and/or decrepit Amfleets, Metroliners, MBBs etc., who would have confidence that with a well resourced plant with anything less than the finances of Siemens behind you that there would be enough orders to keep the doors open?

These guys got big plans:

https://www.masslive.com/business-news/ ... force.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

CRRC has the entire resources of China behind it.

mtuandrew wrote:Counterpoint: what if the Traveling Circus model is the problem? Some things carry across trades without a problem, but I’m not sure how much carries over from auto assembly, construction, metal fabrication, computer tech, or any number of specialized trades when you’re working on a passenger railroad car with at least three voltage standards (440VAC, 110VAC, 74VDC), all-stainless steel construction (which doesn’t happen anywhere else), and duty cycles of 2 million miles.

Maybe a plant that is willing to set down roots would render a better product.

Totally agreed, that's kind of a complementary point to the argument I made about CRRC in Chicago above. Contrast the DE/DM disaster with the product coming out of London, ON or Erie, PA. They made the best passenger engines of the government-operated era, the F40 and Genesis respectively. Same thing with Kawasaki in Nebraska. They just keep turning out cars and doing it reasonably well.

Tadman wrote:Totally agreed, that's kind of a complementary point to the argument I made about CRRC in Chicago above. Contrast the DE/DM disaster with the product coming out of London, ON or Erie, PA. They made the best passenger engines of the government-operated era, the F40 and Genesis respectively. Same thing with Kawasaki in Nebraska. They just keep turning out cars and doing it reasonably well.

Makes me hope for MPI to move some of its current production (MPXpress and any HSP-46T4) to Erie for that same reason, once they finish swallowing the carcass of GETS.

Don't you think that will go to Fort Worth? Fort Worth is a nice new facility while Erie is ancient and has labor issues.

Ancient often means capable, and labor issues often means underpaid for their expertise. It won’t happen, if anything MPI will close Boise as well as Erie and move everything to Texas, but one can hope.

I have just skimmed through this thread and am wondering, if the Siemens order works out and they finish their merge with Alstom (Assuming it hasn't happened, I wanted to type while the iron was hot and didn't google anything) if Siemens then has the bi level designs, could the option to buy be used and California and Illinois trade the used Siemens cars for bi levels and hand the single levels over to replace Amfleet or at least start replacing them? As for the Horizon cars, I say get creative.

dp

tomj wrote:I if Siemens then has the bi level designs, could the option to buy be used and California and Illinois trade the used Siemens cars for bi levels and hand the single levels over to replace Amfleet or at least start replacing them? As for the Horizon cars, I say get creative.

Do not replace Amfleets except for those few that are basket cases. Instead first expand capacity on present routes by adding freed up Amfleet cars onto present trains. Then as enough Siemens cars come available make a couple Superliner trains single level allowing for strenghtened western trains. Then if some Amfleets become surplus to rush season demand park them as surge capacity and charter work ?

East point: I bet the Capitol Limited is the next to get single-leveled. If it were up to me, the Cap would become a CHI-WAS-NYP train and the Cardinal would be CHI-WAS with Superliners, but it isn’t up to me.

Agree about Capital but not Cardinal. Until Amtrak gets more Superliner type cars ( 10+ years IMHO ) some Superliner trains will only get single leveled as SL equipment gets sidelined for what ever reason.. It might be CNO and Eagle and Sunset single leveled to make a daily Sunset. NOL and SAS maybe FTW and single level Heartland.could then ship sparse spare parts to other locations. Spare parts for the older SLs are getting slim and concentrating into fewer locations would appear important.