Rochester & Southern Railroad (RSR) Discussion

And quit telling railroaders that they're wrong... Majority of they have wealthy of knowledge, far more than you and I do... Dont drive him away... We lost couple good ones...

- All the documents for the 1000' siding expansion state the Town of Groveland for the mine. That's from the mine owners, railroad, and state DEC.

- Mt. Morris is meaningless for an address. That's just the Post Office. I don't live where my mailing city is but that's what the PO uses. I live in the town which has a different name.

How about this address?

Applicant: American Rock Salt Co LLC
PO Box 172
Groveland, NY 14462-0172

I get there are semantics about the location but every person in this thread knew exactly where Matt or anyone else was talking about. A simple thread posting stating for everyone's clarification the railroad's location name, Hampton Corners is the geographical name (it's not an incorporated body; it's not even a hamlet), in the Town of Groveland, should have been fine.

While we're on it, for future use in another thread (maybe in reference to the D&MM or PRR), the Groveland Correctional Facility is not in Groveland either by the standards of this thread. It's in Sonyea (green road sign and railroad Official Guide). So if Chris brings up hiking along the railroad here and mentions where he was, hopefully this clarification can ward off a wayward thread.

Charles, agreed the mailing address and municipal boundaries of the mine are Groveland. What makes the detail important is that there is a railroad location - on the same railroad as the mine - by the name of Groveland. THAT location is on a different branch and would not be seen by a train working the mine out of Rochester. So the answer to the question "was the train coming back from Groveland" would be "no". And how would you handle it if an ARS competitor opened a salt mine at the actual station location of Groveland?

I guess from a railfan perspective, it's OK to "know what was meant". Railroading as a business has always required a literal interpretation of details. Men have been killed because they were told to wait for engine 2453 to go by before they left the siding. After engine 2543 went by, they "knew" it was a typo and started out, only to run head on into engine 2453. I made up the numbers to illustrate the point but you get the idea. This is a railfan forum and municipal boundaries should mean far less than actual station names. The R&S yard here is in the town of Gates - so maybe we should say the salt moved from Groveland to Gates? I don't think so.

As Ken said, "we know that mine is at hampton corner. We have been using that name for past many years". Well, most of us anyway.

I'm not going to argue with someone over locations on a railroad that I'm qualified on. For future reference, I will be using the railroad designated station locations when I refer to locations. The GW-1 runs on a pretty strict 11am basis. Any other train will be an extra or the RS1. They aren't going to be bringing back lumber cars from the salt mine, and the NS is the only class 1 that is interchanged with south or Brooks so put 2 and 2 together.

nydepot wrote:How about this address?

Applicant: American Rock Salt Co LLC
PO Box 172
Groveland, NY 14462-0172

it's P.O. Box! You can get P.O. box in Erie, Pa or Forest Lakes Estates, AZ if you want to... I would chose Groveland P.O. box over Mt Morris... less customers and would get know with these people at Groveland P.O. better..


The application for permit or anything requires them to fill out EVERYTHING... including "town of ....." like i said political crap reason.

matt is long time member in here and he would know that the mine is in Hampton Corner... or at least read that the salt mine is in Hampton Corner... There is plenty of tiny towns around here that does not have need for zip code since bigger town's P.O. can handle the volume of mails for that smaller next door town..

Ok... BR&P - It seems that we now no longer call this location - Retsof, NY. Because of this discussion, we got to call that location - York, NY.... Retsof is a hamlet within the town of York..

Finally some humor.

BTW, Retsof has it's own PO and American Rock Salt has offices here too on Retsof Rd. Even more confusing!

sd80mac wrote:Ok... BR&P - It seems that we now no longer call this location - Retsof, NY. Because of this discussion, we got to call that location - York, NY.... Retsof is a hamlet within the town of York..

I'm out. No point in inviting post removal or thread locking. I've expressed my opinion and I recognize that other opinions differ. That's what a forum is all about.

Will the incinerated SW unit from P&L be shipped out, or cut up on the spot?

I spent some time in Rochester 87/88. I enjoyed watching long lashups of 6 to 8 semi-functioning antique diesels hauling long trains south out of Brooks yard, or whatever its proper name may be. I appreciate all the posts I see here on the R&S and wanted to say thank you to all the posters here, no matter how contentious your arguments about P.O. Boxes and station locations, I enjoy the discussion.

Shipping on the burned locomotive most likely depends on how badly it burned, and to some degree who buys it. Being an EMD, there's some hope of re-use or repair if the fire didn't destroy the traction motors and wheel bearings and so forth. If it can't be moved, then I would expect it to be cut up where it sits, or very close to where it sits - it could be dragged a short distance if needed. Without photos or actually inspecting what's left of it, will just have to wait and see.

I have some more pics from Nov. 10:

When the train gets to the Mt. Morris station (which is now Private Property), the engines uncouple from the train. The lead unit also uncouples and grabs the empties.

This one engine and the empty salt cars, head towards the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220357" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220358" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The remaining engines then head to the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220359" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They then couple on to the end of the train (with one engine and all the empties) and push them up the hill to the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220360" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220361" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220362" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220363" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Early work has begun on extending the loading track at the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220364" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

lvrr325 wrote:Shipping on the burned locomotive most likely depends on how badly it burned, and to some degree who buys it. Being an EMD, there's some hope of re-use or repair if the fire didn't destroy the traction motors and wheel bearings and so forth. If it can't be moved, then I would expect it to be cut up where it sits, or very close to where it sits - it could be dragged a short distance if needed. Without photos or actually inspecting what's left of it, will just have to wait and see.

From the few pictures I saw, I suspect it'll leave the site in pieces.

thebigham wrote:I have some more pics from Nov. 10:

When the train gets to the Mt. Morris station (which is now Private Property), the engines uncouple from the train. The lead unit also uncouples and grabs the empties.

This one engine and the empty salt cars, head towards the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220357" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220358" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The remaining engines then head to the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220359" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They then couple on to the end of the train (with one engine and all the empties) and push them up the hill to the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220360" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220361" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220362" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220363" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Early work has begun on extending the loading track at the mine:
http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=220364" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That's not a new bridge, it's 3 sections of the old DL&W bridge that spans the Genesee River.

^I meant a new bridge at that location.

Can someone please post when the mine train and the Silver Springs train switches hours.

Right now, the mine train goes on duty at 11am. The Silver Springs train 11pm.

Soon they will switch on duty times.

I'd like to take daylight pics of the Silver Springs train between Warsaw and Silver Springs.

Thanks!