Arrows vs. Silverliners

So this came up in discussion before. I know its a SEPTA thing but it's about NJT too, so I brought it up here.

I was comparing the Arrow vs. Silverliners, and came up with the idea that the Silverliner III is similar to the Arrow I (somewhat), and the Silverliner IV is like an Arrow II/III mix. But, if one were to couple an Arrow III to a Silverliner IV, would the cars work right away? I'm not sure of the specifics so I thought I would consult the experts.

And, am I the only one mad that we had to give SEPTA, of all agencies, an Arrow II? Haha.

I doubt that an Arrow III could MU with an Silverliner IV, since all the A-IIIs were rebuilt with AC traction and upgraded control/computer systems.

Unless all the MU circuits located in the coupler heads are identical (i.e. trainlined controls in the same location at the same voltages and same functions), maybe they might be able to run together.

Also, the brake valve schedules are different, which might produce undesired train handling. The A-IIIs have a 26-type brake valve, whereas a Silverliner IV has a PS-68 (24) type brake valve.

While the mechanical and pneumatic portions of the coupler will mate up between a AIII and a Silverliner, the electrical connections do not line up, and would pretty much prevent using them together in regular service.

Also, the PS 68 is a schedule 26 brake. It is also found on NJT Comet Is, and is by far my favorite brake stand to use.

Hm, well makes sense to me then!

Anyone else think its dumb how SEPTA uses half a married pair? Or were they given it like that?

They were made in both married and single-car configurations, as were the Arrows. You couldn't use a half-pair, because the pairs share equipment.

But then why is the non-cab end of the Arrow II a flat gray?

Example

That's because its been converted to a cab car and no longer provides the use as being a powered MU car. The white pan on the top is similar to the white pan on the NJT wire train, which looks the same but with an old baggage car type car. The pan, I believe, is only used to test the installed/maintanced overhead wires.

I am talking about Nasadowsk's statement:

They were made in both married and single car configurations, as were the Arrows. You couldn't use a half-pair because the pairs share equipment.

Yeah, the Arrow II was converted to a cab car only, but it seems to be one half of a married pair. There are no blanked out windows or anything indicating it was a single car.

My sources inform me that the Arrow II on the SPAX wire train is, in fact, one half of a married pair. The pair was separated and this car was converted to camp/cab car duties.

Oh, the wire train. I thought you were referring to regular Septic trains. Nevermind...

amtrakhogger wrote:I doubt that an Arrow III could MU with an Silverliner IV, since all the A-IIIs were rebuilt with AC traction and upgraded control/computer systems.

We routinely operated the rebuilt AIII's with our existing AII's. So the AC traction isn't/wasn't an issue.

Sirsonic wrote: ↑Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:30 pm While the mechanical and pneumatic portions of the coupler will mate up between a AIII and a Silverliner, the electrical connections do not line up, and would pretty much prevent using them together in regular service.

Also, the PS 68 is a schedule 26 brake. It is also found on NJT Comet Is, and is by far my favorite brake stand to use.

I should mention that the PS-68 brake on the Silverliner IV is not a self-lapping brake, so it is more similar to a 24 brake in that respect.