Chicago Hub

Everything else is to Michigan and also single level.

Converting the Capitol to single level if necessary should be a no-brainer.

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2023 3:40 pm But where do they come up with more Single-Level Cars, Mr. Olesen?

Yes, a "timetable turn" of 1.5hrs is done (arrival #30 at WAS to departure of #29) all the time by airlines - even if the flight is inbound from overseas. But "this is Amtrak" and they don't do things like that.

This last observation about timetable turns is an interesting comment that doesn't seem to reply to anything in this thread. I might have missed something, but I wonder if it was motivated by my question about how quickly an extended Illini / Saluki could be turned in Memphis.

It may be a wise decision for Amtrak not to try to turn trains more quickly, based in sound economics. The airlines have different economies of scale. They can afford to put 5 or more cleaning staff on a plane as soon as the passengers are off, moving that cleaning group to the next plane a half hour later. Even at Chicago Union Station, Amtrak doesn't have so many trains coming in that it would make sense to keep a large cleaning staff on the clock, I'd guess. The more trains they put on the schedule, the more likely that makes sense, allowing for faster turnarounds.

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2023 3:40 pm But where do they come up with more Single-Level Cars, Mr. Olesen?

By the time CHIP would be in place, Airo's should be on the property, and quite possibly the new LD orders would be in motion if not underway.

Arguably, you could run the Cardinal with an Airo, sans sleeper/diner but with Business Class. How many people are realistically riding in a sleeper from DC to Chicago? Maybe a few sleepers from Siemens in the Airo framework are a better long term pitch?

I've made it no secret that I believe the LD order should be for single level equipment.

A curious sentence from today's White House press release on rail funding grants:
>Major regional hubs will benefit from multiple corridor selections, such as the Chicago Hub, where a comprehensive plan for the Chicago terminal and service chokepoints south of Lake Michigan will benefit all corridors and long-distance trains south and east of Chicago.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-roo ... e-country/

That would be true, except the program being detailed in this press release didn't fund the comprehensive plan for the service chokepoints. Union Station is not currently a chokepoint.

I guess one way of interpreting that sentence that offers a little more hope is the idea that the Wolverine, Port Huron and Grand Rapids planning grants of $500k each will be devoted in part or in whole to advancing the Airline and/or South of the Lake projects.

I may have been wrong to be disappointed seeing the latest round of grants gave $120 million for Chicago Union Station improvements but didn't fund other CHIP items -- the ones more important for reliability and speed.

A poster on Reddit pointed out that Amtrak already included $175 million for CHIP in its FY 2024 budget request.

I do realize the federal budget still up in the air, of course. But I hadn't realized Amtrak might be planning to fund much of CHIP out of its budget. That makes me more optimistic CHIP may get done in the near term.

There are different estimates for the cost of CHIP. The Sun-Times mentions $850 million. Trains, back in 2022 showed about $420 million plus unknowns. Here is the Trains itemization:

• $132 million -- Union Station improvements, which were funded last week, the remainder of CHIP was estimated at
  $146 million - Airline to Union Station
  $20 million - replacing displaced functions
  $91 million - Airline to Rock Island District, plus Joliet platform
  $20 million in double-tracking in Michigan, a hugely important improvement to MI services but not inherently part of solving the South Side Swamp
  Unknown Cost - buying part of the underused Kensington line along the lake; and paying the South Shore for access to its mostly Indiana trackage.

Is it possible they've received information from CN and the South Shore, and that's the difference between the Trains itemization from 2022 and the Sun-Times figure earlier this year? Would those two things potentially cost $400 million?

At any rate, realizing Amtrak had already sought money that is close to the cost of the Union Station-St. Charles Air Line access and accommodating displaced functions makes me feel better about prospects here.

eolesen wrote: ↑Wed Dec 06, 2023 2:24 pm Everything else is to Michigan and also single level.

Converting the Capitol to single level if necessary should be a no-brainer.

They can run bilevel cars under the wires and do all the time. Amtrak has occasionally run superliners under the wire on detours.

ryanwc wrote: ↑Sat Dec 09, 2023 9:48 am
Unknown Cost - buying part of the underused Kensington line along the lake; and paying the South Shore for access to its mostly Indiana trackage.[/list]

CN still uses enough of that line I'd be shocked if they let it go completely. But if you do a helicopter ride courtesy of Google Maps, you'll see that there is a plenty of space for Amtrak to build a single track or even double from McCormick Place to Kensington.

You still have to get over the hump between 14th street and McCormick place, and the SCAL sucks for that. It's slow and twisty and there is often a freight train parked there waiting for room to get moving again. Obviously there are bridge problems and the bridge faces the wrong way requiring a backup move.

The correct solution to me has always been to send Amtrak down the the PRR to Grand Crossing, build a flyover to the IC alignment, then run on South Shore toward the east (for the approriate trackage rights payments).

Instead they built the third main in Northwest Indiana, which was a bad idea from the start that never worked. The CSS Freight guys wanted nothing to do with Amtrak at the time because of the single track east of Gary. What non-locals don't see is the immense amount of switching using the main for head room in between passenger trains.

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2024 9:59 am Anyone care to play?

https://survey3.medallia.com/?8QzuBB-Concourse

This has been getting some airtime on WBBM 780/105.9 of late.

Sure, I'll throw in my "meh" response.