The "Ocean" VIA Overnight Sleeper

I'm curious as to why they didn't use a Park car like they normally do.

What a contrast it must be walking from the smaller Renaissance sleeper to the more spacious interior of the Skyline Dome plus the awesome view from the dome itself! (The second best seat behind the engineer, I consider it.)






XC Tower

warwgn3 wrote:I'm curious as to why they didn't use a Park car like they normally do.

The Park Car only runs during the summer and fall and has for a few years now.....Not year ‘round. It is the “Signature” car on the Ocean when Sleeper Plus (or Touring Class or Easterly Class.....call it what you want) is offered.

During the summer regular sleeper passengers do not have access to a Dome so I believe VIA is just trying to preserve this amenity they can charge extra for. But for now.....a Skyline Dome will be available to all sleeper passengers in the off-season.

XC Tower wrote:What a contrast it must be walking from the smaller Renaissance sleeper to the more spacious interior of the Skyline Dome plus the awesome view from the dome itself! (The second best seat behind the engineer, I consider it.)

Personally, I’ll take a Ren sleeper any day over an old Budd! Shake and rattle compared to the smooth riding Rens. But for now you have the best of both worlds…….accommodations in the Rens plus the view from the Skyline Dome!

The Dome seems to be a railfan thing and just doesn’t have the same appeal to others. I’ve been riding the Ocean for many years and even when the Park Car was available to all sleeper passengers……it was usually wide open spaces. About the only time it was ever full was during the morning when a complimentary continental breakfast was offered. Even then, people would stay a few minutes then head back to their rooms.

It does have an appeal to more passengers when passing thru the mountains on the Canadian. But once on the prairies, again wide open spaces and never a problem getting a seat.

NS VIA FAN wrote:

warwgn3 wrote:I'm curious as to why they didn't use a Park car like they normally do.

The Park Car only runs during the summer and fall and has for a few years now.....Not year ‘round. It is the “Signature” car on the Ocean when Sleeper Plus (or Touring Class or Easterly Class.....call it what you want) is offered.

During the summer regular sleeper passengers do not have access to a Dome so I believe VIA is just trying to preserve this amenity they can charge extra for. But for now.....a Skyline Dome will be available to all sleeper passengers in the off-season.

I'm aware of the seasonal Park car in the summer. But when I took the Ocean both ways in March 2012, both my trains consisted entirely of Budd equipment with a Skyline, and no Park. However this may only be the case when the Ocean was not scheduled to be joined with the Chaleur.

warwgn3 wrote:I'm aware of the seasonal Park car in the summer. But when I took the Ocean both ways in March 2012, both my trains consisted entirely of Budd equipment with a Skyline, and no Park. However this may only be the case when the Ocean was not scheduled to be joined with the Chaleur.

For several winter one of the three consists required for the Ocean was a Budd set and it included a Skyline Dome. The other two consists were Ren only…..without a Dome.

VIA was upgrading the Rens for Barrier Free access and other modifications so one Ren consist would be pulled for the winter and replaced with a Budd. It had nothing to do with combining with the Chaleur.

Only two consists are required now for the Ocean on the new tri-weekly schedule so I don’t imagine a Budd set will be back this winter.

NS VIA FAN wrote:

warwgn3 wrote:I'm aware of the seasonal Park car in the summer. But when I took the Ocean both ways in March 2012, both my trains consisted entirely of Budd equipment with a Skyline, and no Park. However this may only be the case when the Ocean was not scheduled to be joined with the Chaleur.

For several winter one of the three consists required for the Ocean was a Budd set and it included a Skyline Dome. The other two consists were Ren only…..without a Dome.

VIA was upgrading the Rens for Barrier Free access and other modifications so one Ren consist would be pulled for the winter and replaced with a Budd. It had nothing to do with combining with the Chaleur.

Only two consists are required now for the Ocean on the new tri-weekly schedule so I don’t imagine a Budd set will be back this winter.

And it will be interesting to see if the third consist eventually goes to the Chaleur (train to Gaspe) - when it does finally get restored as a train all the way to Gaspe. Hopefully it can retain a Skyline Dome Car or Park Dome Car.

I know they run a "Park Car" in "High Season"
I have heard there is a mid-train Dome run on the rear of the train during the "Off Season" when the "Park Car" is removed?
So this means, the "Ocean" has a "Dome" car year round on it?
Can anybody elaborate on this?
Also how many cars does it normally run with not counting the "Gaspe " section?
Thanks!:D

Yes, there is now a dome car year-round. In the peak seasons, roughly mid-June to mid-October and for two weeks near Christmas,there is a Park car. The rest of the time it is a Skyline car at the end of the train. Recently a few runs had a Park car instead of a Skyline, but there was speculation this was because of some damage to one of the Skyline cars. Reservia showed sleeping car space available for sale in some of the Park cars, but not all of them.

The usual off-peak consist is baggage, two or three coaches, service car-diner-service car, four or five sleepers, transition car and Skyline. In the peak season there are usually four coaches and six to eight sleepers. Occasionally a Manor or Château-series sleeper has been operated as well.

When a Skyline is running, the Gaspe Section....F40 and all, is just attached to the rear. And during the winter, I’ve noticed the Skyline has an orange tarp covering the coupler to protect it from ice and snow to facilitate this.

When a Park is on the rear, the Gaspe Section goes on the front between the F40’s and the Halifax Renaissance section.

marquisofmississauga wrote:Yes, there is now a dome car year-round. In the peak seasons, roughly mid-June to mid-October and for two weeks near Christmas,there is a Park car. The rest of the time it is a Skyline car at the end of the train. Recently a few runs had a Park car instead of a Skyline, but there was speculation this was because of some damage to one of the Skyline cars. Reservia showed sleeping car space available for sale in some of the Park cars, but not all of them.

The usual off-peak consist is baggage, two or three coaches, service car-diner-service car, four or five sleepers, transition car and Skyline. In the peak season there are usually four coaches and six to eight sleepers. Occasionally a Manor or Château-series sleeper has been operated as well.

Thank you! :D

Just playing Devil’s Advocate here......

Is it time for the Ocean to be privatized? The public has long ago voted that they prefer flying or highway travel to rail. For example, today (a Sunday) on the Ocean you have a capacity of about 250 persons from Halifax and Moncton to Montreal (with connections to Ottawa and Toronto). But flying today you have the following available:

Halifax – Montreal: 750 seats
Halifax – Ottawa: 650 seats
Halifax – Toronto: 1,300 seats

Moncton – Montreal: 200 seats
Moncton – Ottawa: 200 seats
Moncton – Toronto: 450 seats

That’s a total of nearly 3,550 seats today from the Maritimes to Central Canada vs: only 250 seats on the Ocean (or nearly 25 thousand seats per week each way vs: only 750 on the Ocean) and that doesn’t include flights from Bathurst and Mont Joli, the Bus or those that just hop in their car and drive the Trans Canada which is now all 4-lane freeway except for about 60 km.

Let a company such as Rocky Mountaineer take over the Ocean. The government would still subsidize the cost to provide basic coach accommodations for those that have no other option for travel from communities such as Miramichi, Campbellton or Riviere-du-Loup. But for Sleeping Car travel, the passenger should pay the actual cost of providing that service.

As a taxpayer, I have no problem providing you with basic transportation (coach) the same as I pay for road construction but why should I be subsidizing your sleeping car travel. The same goes for the Canadian. Subsidize the basic coach portion but have Rocky Mountaineer (or similar company) take over the Sleepers. Charge what the market will bear........They certainly can run a first-class operation and don’t seem to have a problem filling their trains with tourists. The privatized trains would still provide travel to intermediate points unlike the end-point only travel on the Rocky Mountaineer today.

Perhaps the Ocean should be cut back to Moncton in the off-season or operate coach only between Moncton and Halifax with the sleepers running only during the summer (& holidays)***.

I’ve been on the Ocean a couple of times this past winter and the coaches seemed to be doing a pretty good business but there was almost no one in the sleepers until we reached Moncton and west. They're all on those flights out of YHZ.....2 hrs vs: 24 hrs!

***Rocky Mountaineer or some other private firm could run a high-end tourist orientated operation with sleepers, domes and dining cars attached to the coach portion.

NS VIA FAN wrote:Just playing Devil’s Advocate here......

Is it time for the Ocean to be privatized?

There is simply not feasible way to render the service profitable in this area. Let's be honest, even with the greatest marketing campaign a business could put forward, the fact is that the majority of the daytime scenery (past Memramcook until Charlo on route #15) is about as exciting as 3am CBC is going to remain. One could never dare to compare the rich mountaineer's route to the ocean's. without such appeal there is simply no business to be had. The Ocean is a essential public transport method to many remote low income communities and should simply be viewed as such.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scot ... -1.2513711
Via Rail's Maritime-Quebec passenger service in doubt.
CN announced last week that it will discontinue operations on a 70-kilometre section connecting Bathurst to Miramichi because their freight cars don't use the line.Via Rail's Ocean line runs on the same route. Spokesperson Mylène Bélanger said Via Rail will maintain the connection between Quebec and Halifax for as long as it can, but will not acquire the railway itself. CN said operations will be maintained on the tracks between Nelson Junction and Nepisiquit Junction for at least five months while the rail line is put up for sale.

Will there be any tracks left, much less a train, for a private operator to run the Ocean?