Northeast Regional 188 - Accident In Philadelphia

I'm pretty sure they have the bare minimum down and just worded some things poorly in some of the statements they have issued. I'm not going to go into detail much but I know the ACS64's event recorder can be downloaded remotely so they probably knew certain things right off the bat but don't want to reveal fully into the investigation takes its course.

Two articles from The New Yorker related to this accident:

http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-com ... nst-trains" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Adam Gopnik, fair use quote wrote:The horrific Amtrak derailment outside Philadelphia this week set off some predictable uncertainty about what exactly had happened—a reckless motorman? An inadequate track? A missing mechanical device? Some combination of them all?—and an even more vibrant set of arguments about the failure of Americans to build any longer for the common good. Everyone agrees that our rail system is frail and accident-prone: one tragedy can end the service up and down the entire path from Boston to Washington, and beyond, for days on end. And everyone knows that American infrastructure—what used to be called our public works, or just our bridges and railways, once the envy of the world—has now been stripped bare, and is being stripped ever barer.
...

I don't agree with Mr. Gopnik's article in its entirety, especially since he has factual errors (NYP-WAS trains were not faster 50 years ago, for instance), but it makes for interesting reading.

http://www.newyorker.com/news/john-cass ... astructure" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

John Cassidy, fair use quote wrote:...
I was tempted to compose a tweet about contrasting approaches to investing in transportation infrastructure, but I didn’t bother. At this stage, it has become something of a cliché to compare Amtrak to Japanese bullet trains and the Eurostar, or J.F.K. to airports in Hong Kong and Singapore. Last year, when Vice-President Joe Biden said that La Guardia looked like it was in the “third world,” some New Yorkers pretended to be offended, Mayor de Blasio and Governor Cuomo among them. But everyone was aware that Biden was only speaking the truth.
...

Mr. Cassidy's article is better, and better-informed. He recognizes that we aren't going from 79 mph LDs to 300 mph bullet trains in the blink of an eye, but also that transportation infrastructure is becoming a persistent issue in America.


Neither article is fully about the crash in North Philadelphia, but both are reflections on the conditions that helped bring it about.

NH2060 wrote:Considering the plaintiff is an Amtrak employee this appears to be more of a "standard procedure" thing. In order to get the compensation, etc. that they are entitled to as employees they technically need to file a lawsuit even if there are no "hard feelings" if that's the way to describe it.

I'm not sure on that. You are speaking of a FELA claim which would apply if the person was on duty. The article makes it sound like he may have been on his way TO work, which would suggest to this not-a-lawyer he would just be another passenger. (unless his deadhead was being done under the hours of service for some reason).

I have been listening to the FD/PD dispatch recordings from the incident on youtube and rather than discuss or speculate anything more than what has already been said I'd rather point out what an EXCELLENT job "Philly's Finest" did in this situation. This was a MAJOR incident for them and they handled it beautifully. Every report is calm, professional and "textbook." This is not an "easy" thing, but comes with training and experience that can make it seem easy to outsiders. Anyone who has any experience in this field will understand what I am saying here. If the first responders in this situation had not responded as quickly, efficiently and professionally as they did the situation would have no doubt been worse and the casualties much higher.
BRAVO-ZULU Philly!

mtuandrew wrote: http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-com ... nst-trains" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Adam Gopnik, fair use quote wrote:Everyone agrees that our rail system is frail and accident-prone: one tragedy can end the service up and down the entire path from Boston to Washington, and beyond, for days on end. And everyone knows that American infrastructure—what used to be called our public works, or just our bridges and railways, once the envy of the world—has now been stripped bare, and is being stripped ever barer.
...

I don't agree with Mr. Gopnik's article in its entirety, especially since he has factual errors (NYP-WAS trains were not faster 50 years ago, for instance), but it makes for interesting reading.

What kind of foolishness is this? The "entire path" is not ended for days on end, so what does he mean by further stating there is trouble with the system "beyond" DC or Boston? There is a temporary cripple in the link, sure, because trackage was torn apart. But service is still running NY to Boston, and from Phila to DC, and in between there are alternate local train routings, albeit slow and pushed almost beyond capacity. Adam Gopnik likes the hyperbole, and evidently should stick to what he knows.

For those of you worried about how much this will cost tax payers after lawsuits, keep in mind that there is a federal statute that limits Amtrak's civil liability to $200,000,000. With 250+ pax on a train that isn't a lot for each person. And with $15,000,000,0000 on the gov't credit card, what's another $200,000,000 basically like spitting in the ocean. And yes lawyers will get rich off this.

As for the engineer "not remembering" I'd say that is bs. However, it is VERY smart on his part to say that and to keep his mouth shut. Under NO circumstances should you EVER open your mouth to police when you are in potential criminal trouble under ANY circumstances because you will ALWAYS sink your own ship. This engineer was a rail fan, very responsible, and seems like a nice guy. He is potentially facing 8 homicide charges among other potential charges. If they can't prove he was negligent beyond a doubt then he's off the hook (he doesn't remember...brakes went out, accelerator got stuck, projectile hit him in the head, etc). He agreed to drug/alcohol test let's assume they are negative. The police just got a warrant to search his phone records, now let's assume he was not on the phone/texting.

Did anyone here consider that maybe he just screwed up? How many times have you been driving your car and you look down at the speedo and see it at 85mph when you thought you were going 65mph? Or you see the red light and coast thru anyway? We are all human and we all screw up once in a while. He could have though he was in a different section of track or whatever. It happens.

Why media outlets are so focused on him being homosexual and nerdy I have no idea because that doesn't relate to the accident at all.

carajul wrote:As for the engineer "not remembering" I'd say that is bs. However, it is VERY smart on his part to say that and to keep his mouth shut. Under NO circumstances should you EVER open your mouth to police when you are in potential criminal trouble under ANY circumstances because you will ALWAYS sink your own ship

Whether the amnesia is BS or not, you are correct that the 5th Amendment really works best for the innocent if they keep silent, and cops agree.

Anyone know
1. Location/s on the train where fatalities were sitting?
2. Any survivors at all from Business Class (first car)

SwingDog wrote:The European media is raising more facts

Please provide links and let us judge for ourselves. Meta-critique of media isn't relevant here.

carajul wrote: Did anyone here consider that maybe he just screwed up?

Lots of things are possible. At this point I am only interested in what the NTSB has to say.

Cosmo wrote:I have been listening to the FD/PD dispatch recordings from the incident on youtube and rather than discuss or speculate anything more than what has already been said I'd rather point out what an EXCELLENT job "Philly's Finest" did in this situation. This was a MAJOR incident for them and they handled it beautifully. Every report is calm, professional and "textbook." This is not an "easy" thing, but comes with training and experience that can make it seem easy to outsiders. Anyone who has any experience in this field will understand what I am saying here. If the first responders in this situation had not responded as quickly, efficiently and professionally as they did the situation would have no doubt been worse and the casualties much higher.
BRAVO-ZULU Philly!

Seconded!!! The national media has also picked up on that.

Launcher wrote:

jamesinclair wrote:

Until Amtrak service resumes, Sears said Amtrak customers can exchange their tickets for Greyhound bus tickets.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/loca ... rak-crash/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This insistence by several intercity bus companies to accommodate displaced passengers by accepting rail tickets seems to be in no one's best interest. If I'm a traveler, why not just request a refund from Amtrak for my scheduled train that doesn't run, and get a bus ticket for about one third of the price, if that? Am I missing something?

The bus company takes the ticket and bills Amtrak for the Amtrak fare. Probably bumping the few people who were able to snatch the few seats at really low fares. And telling the walk up trade that they are full up.

Today at 3:09 PM
I will not discount the possibility that a foreign object (rock, brick maybe even a bullet) hit the windshield of that motor. I has happened and it will happen again. How many of you have been in the cab of a locomotive that got struck by a rock, brick or something else, it is not a fun experience. I could distract a person's attention for an instant, it hits with a loud crash without any clue or warning. I could divert one's attention for a moment or two and indeed maybe longer. I could result in flying glass although that might be the situation in this particular case. In any event the engineer could have blacked out long enough to mess up really bad. Let me tell you a little about my nasty auto accident back on Thanksgiving Day. I was about a half mile from my condo on my way to dinner not too far away. I stopped at a stop sign for Oakland Park Blvd. and saw the way to be clear and pulled out in to the street preparing to turn left. That was the last that I knew until I came to in the Emergency Room of Broward General quite a few minutes later. I had no idea what happened or even where I was until I was told. Based on my personal experiences I am more than willing to give this person the benefit of any doubt until we know for certain just exactly happened and what the circumstances were. I don't think very many on here have ever experienced a rock coming at them while moving maybe 70 MPH, I don't know what the speed of the rock is but I would guess the rock would hit the windshield at a combined speed of well in excess of 100 MPH, pretty scary.
Noel Weaver

ryanov wrote:This looks to be the most pleasant alternative, unless you are dying to experience the River Line (which is pleasant enough in its own way).

This would be pretty useful right now...

glennk419 wrote:

Cosmo wrote:I have been listening to the FD/PD dispatch recordings from the incident on youtube and rather than discuss or speculate anything more than what has already been said I'd rather point out what an EXCELLENT job "Philly's Finest" did in this situation. This was a MAJOR incident for them and they handled it beautifully. Every report is calm, professional and "textbook." This is not an "easy" thing, but comes with training and experience that can make it seem easy to outsiders. Anyone who has any experience in this field will understand what I am saying here. If the first responders in this situation had not responded as quickly, efficiently and professionally as they did the situation would have no doubt been worse and the casualties much higher.
BRAVO-ZULU Philly!

Seconded!!! The national media has also picked up on that.

A friend of mine is with Philadelphia's Office of Emergency Management, and has done stellar work with this accident. Thirded.