NEC now Fixed Seating Including Rear-Facing

bostontrainguy wrote:

Tadman wrote: ↑Thu Feb 29, 2024 2:55 pm All of these FRA dream trains will have backwards seating. Unless of course they go with my brilliant idea of just runnig a loop from Pocatello through Flint, Huntsville, Joplin, Merced, and back to Pocatello.

I doubt Chicago - Miami (probably number one on the list) falls under that situation.

No, but it is increasingly a one way itinerary...

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"This offers the option to choose the direction in which they are most comfortable facing."
Now that's Marketing; finding exactly the right shade of lipstick to put on the pig.

Regarding walkover seats, the ones on the PRR P70's on what is now called the Corridor had well-upholstered seatbacks high enough to include a padded headrest; they weren't bad for the distances involved. And of course they were flipped at destination as described above by dhturbo (Mar. 3).

Wow, I didn't realize one could fill 5 pages and counting dissecting the pros and cons of which way seats face on a train.

Wait until you find out that even some planes have seats facing backwards! The blasphemy!

lensovet wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2024 1:09 am Wow, I didn't realize one could fill 5 pages and counting dissecting the pros and cons of which way seats face on a train.

Wait until you find out that even some planes have seats facing backwards! The blasphemy!

Motion sickness is caused by visual disorientation affecting the inner ear. Not much visual stimulation on a plane vs. riding a train with the scenery constantly rushing by you at 125 mph. No comparison.

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2024 9:18 am During my "time in", I flew on enough military aircraft to know what it was like to have zero windows and seated "subway style".

Happily do without.

Amen insofar as it goes on flights. I've done both backward and sideway flying in military craft.

On trains, my preference is forward, but I'm okay with backward-facing if that's what's available.

jwhite07 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 01, 2024 12:46 pm How about this? Get used to riding backwards. Millions of rail passengers do it, every day, worldwide. If it's not your cuppa, don't take the train.

Yeah, it's really not a big deal. Every commuter rail/regional rail train I've ever been on has been 50/50 on front and rear facing seats.

Flying without windows and getting motion sickness is understandable -- some people need more of a visual reference for maintaining equilibrium. It's the same with cruise ships and the lack of windows on interior cabins. At least one cruise line is now using a full-wall video monitor as a "virtual balcony" and while it might be a placebo effect, it certainly reduced my wife's motion sickness.

And yet, riding backward on a train for her is not a problem as long as there's a visual reference for the motion, even if it's only distant lights at night.

As built Amfleet and Horizon coaches had reversible seats but these are the OLD Cars.
The new Airo fleet and others will have fixed seating - the NEW Cars.
Seems like a majority of Amtrak passengers prefer facing in the direction of travel.
Heaven forbid the OLD Cars would be preferable to the NEW Cars.
BUT if we make take away this positive feature of the OLD Cars BEFORE they are replaced by the NEW,
that will quiet the complaining about the NEW Cars being inferior to what they are replacing.
I'm sure this "psychology" went into Amtrak's decision but I doubt if they will ever admit it.

Amtrak will be adding cab cars to all the NEC regional day trains. The reason is to have faster turnarounds so they can run more trains using the same number of rolling stock. Adding a requirement to turn all the seats significantly slows the turnaround. You'll be defeating the reason for adding the cab car.
a 4 seat per row, 60 seats per car, or 30 two seat pairs per car, over 8 cars per train, sums up to 240 pairs of seats to turn. Assuming it takes 30 seconds to turn each seat pair, that's 120 minutes or two hours to turn all the seats.
Why waste 2 hours turning seats? If your reply is they could add personnel to do this task to reduce the time, you have not lost any work hours nor reduce any labor costs.

CVRA7 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 10:26 am As built Amfleet and Horizon coaches had reversible seats but these are the OLD Cars.
The new Airo fleet and others will have fixed seating - the NEW Cars.
Seems like a majority of Amtrak passengers prefer facing in the direction of travel.
Heaven forbid the OLD Cars would be preferable to the NEW Cars.
BUT if we make take away this positive feature of the OLD Cars BEFORE they are replaced by the NEW,
that will quiet the complaining about the NEW Cars being inferior to what they are replacing.
I'm sure this "psychology" went into Amtrak's decision but I doubt if they will ever admit it.

Not sure exactly how this will go. Reports from riders say the NEW seats on the NEW cars are narrower, less padded, less reclineable, and basically less comfortable. Funny but the OLD Amfleet may be sorely missed.

electricron wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 11:49 am Amtrak will be adding cab cars to all the NEC regional day trains. The reason is to have faster turnarounds so they can run more trains using the same number of rolling stock. Adding a requirement to turn all the seats significantly slows the turnaround. You'll be defeating the reason for adding the cab car.
a 4 seat per row, 60 seats per car, or 30 two seat pairs per car, over 8 cars per train, sums up to 240 pairs of seats to turn. Assuming it takes 30 seconds to turn each seat pair, that's 120 minutes or two hours to turn all the seats.
Why waste 2 hours turning seats? If your reply is they could add personnel to do this task to reduce the time, you have not lost any work hours nor reduce any labor costs.

I can turn a seat in about 5 to 10 seconds. Its not that hard. Second, watch a video of the Japanese servicing one of their high speed sets. A lot of work gets done in a very very short period of time. As we all know Japanese trains run by the second not like Amtrak where it could be the hour, day, or week.

It's not about the time in operation... it's about repair costs.

Seats with fewer moving parts will cost less in terms of downtime and parts over the 10-15 years that will elapse between cabin overhaul.

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eolesen wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 1:18 pm It's not about the time in operation... it's about repair costs.

Seats with fewer moving parts will cost less in terms of downtime and parts over the 10-15 years that will elapse between cabin overhaul.

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In all my years of following everything passenger rail, I have never heard a peep about seat turning part problems or seat turning times. I have also turned many seats on Amfleet and it is a quick easy procedure.