LIRR 1 & 2 cabooses

LIRR 1 & 2 cabooses were built by the PRR. Were they built for the LIRR or sold to the LIRR as used cabin cars?

Thanks, Roger

I have a shot of PRR steel hack #477604 on a freight at the old Hempstead station taken in April, 1934.

It looks surprisingly like hacks #1 and 2.

I do not know if the Pennsy hack was just a part of an interchange program with the LIRR when one was needed (such as the leased locomotives) or if it was assigned to the LIRR on a regular basis.

I'm curious if it later became either LIRR hack #1 or #2 or if it was a separate hack altogether.

Dave Keller

Dave Keller said, "I have a shot of PRR 477604 at old Hempstead station in April, 1934. It looks surprisingly like hacks #1 and 2."


Hi Dave,

I guess this *isn't* a very hot topic!

It should be no surprise PRR 477604 cabin car looks like LIRR 1 & 2 since these cabooses were built by PRR.

Whether they were built for the LIRR or were sold/leased to LIRR is, of course, another issue.

I'm "surprised" that nobody knows the answer.

Cheers, Roger

Hi Roger:

I know that #1 and #2 were Pennsy built and therefore were of the typical Pennsy design.

I'm just curious if either of them are one and the same with the one shot at Hempstead, or if the Hempstead hack is yet a third possibility.

It appears that no one is alive any longer who would know this information.. . . .

Or someone has the data and just can't be bothered to share it!

You'll find that a common problem amongst a number of the "older" railfans. Many have knowledge and refuse to share it.

My friend and co-author Steve Lynch experienced that phenomen when he was researching freight data to write an article about modeling the Oyster Bay branch. Very little help.

The real kicker is that, after attempting to obtain info and no one can be bothered, you write it down as you think it should be AND THEN the critics come out of the woodwork to tell you that you're wrong!!

There are exceptions to the rule, such as my friend, Ron Zinn who knows tons of data about the past workings of the LIRR and will gladly share it.

I've tried convincing him to write it down so it will be preserved for history.

Everything he tells me I attempt to record for posterity, but he knows so much more!!!

Dave Keller

"You'll find that a common problem amongst a number of the "older" railfans. Many have knowledge and refuse to share it."


I guess a lot of them share it in limited bursts, to make them seem more intelligent or interesting. That's the only thing I can come up with lol. I never looked at it that way, so I dunno if that's the case. I'm a member of a model railroad club and most of the guys have really exciting railroad stories....wether it's about technical stuff about the locomotives or cars, or if it's historical info, or even if it's just stories of trips they've taken on the railroad. That's one of the biggest things that make railroading so special, atleast in my mind....the history and the stories. It's really amazing hearing the stories! I've only been working for the railroad for 3 months now. I can't wait till I've been railroading for 20 years, or even when I'm retired....that way I have my own collection of interesting stories! lol

I too have been curious about 1 and 2.

My questions are, what are build dates for these cars and does any one have an idea when they first showed up on the LIRR ??

Bob Kingman

The earliest shot I have in my archive in LIRR colors is of #2 taken at LIC in August, 1953.

If, indeed, #1 or #2 WAS the Pennsy caboose (#477604) shot at Hempstead in 1934, well . . . . . then at least one of them goes back quite a ways!!!

Dave Keller

We own caboose #1 and have never really been able to obtain good info or photos of it. Its difficult being in a historical society that has little info on the "historical aspect" of the piece of equipment. We wish we had all the answers on what we own. But we don't. I wish I knew more.

And you're right. I have had older guys come up to me at my table at shows and either correct me or outright chastise me for having something inaccurate.

I caught all bloody hell years ago for not seperating the words "Rail Road". Give me a break. Just correct me, smile and I'll be forever grateful!

Hi Joe:

The "Rail Road" vs. "Railroad" debate goes both ways and if the "old time" railfans really KNEW about the railroad, they would know that BOTH ways were correct.

Look back at old, OFFICIAL LIRR public timetables, employee timetables, letterhead, tickets, passes, etc.

You will see that at one point in time "Rail Road" was used and at other times "Railroad" was used.

I continue to use "Rail Road" because I kind of like it. It makes "us" different from "them!!!!"

But . . . . you would NOT be wrong if you used "Railroad!"

So, you old guys who may be reading this and think you know so darn much!! Do a little research before you open your mouth and "remove all doubt" as Mr. Lincoln once said.

Sample #1: "Railroad"

Sample #2: "Rail Road"

Dave Keller

If anyone can come up with a copy of"Cabin Cars Of the PRR"
I'm sure that the info requested would be in there in the LIRR section.
I can't seem to find mine.
Oh! and as far as us "Old Guys" are concerned----some guys just considered it a day to day job and couldn't have cared less about the history or whatever. They just couldn't wait to get out and forget about the job altogether.
Those, like myself, had to keep our secret for many years until we found others with similar interests.
Then again, sometimes it is hard to keep up with passing the info along, as much as we would like to.
Many of us keep up with the input as much as we can and hope that is appreciated.

JJ,

I have that book and was amazed at the inaccuracies. That book could have been so much better. The N-5 caboose info is nominal. It has dimensions and drawings (none that I have checked for accuracy) but that's about it. No text either. But I still look looking at the photos

Hi JJ:

When I mentioned the "old timers" not sharing information, let me set the record straight . . . . I DID NOT mean the old time railroaders!!!!!!!!

I meant the old-time railfans!!!!!! (quirky and eccentric and stingy as dirt!)

I've had nothing but generosity from ALL my old-time LIRR veterans over the years!!!!

Dave Keller

Well, Dave, I'm glad you set that one streight.
It brings to mind a time back in the 1960s when I was working the extra yard list.
One afternoon I covered one of the float jobs in North Shore Yard when the regular crew welcomed an elderly gent on board with his camera.
Everyone was friendly and I found out that he had been riding the job and taking pictures, as he had done for many years.
He explained that he had thousands of LIRR pix from many years back.
When I asked if I could buy some copys from him, he got very indignant and said that if I had copies of his pix then his collection would no longer be unique.

I asked what would happen to all of these pictures when he passed on.
He told me that his daughter had instructions to burn them all.
I told him to get off float flat and don't ever come back while I was the conductor or I would have him arrested for trespassing.

So much for old railfans and their picture collection.
I'm glad that we are not all like that.

Thats a shame. alot of float pics and them some could have been here today,
umm. you never know what people have in there basements or attics. and his daughter if still around could have A. kept them n forgot she has them, B, moved, and tossed them or left the behind n they get tossed, C. complied with that morons wishes and burnt them.

all i have to say is (what an ass)

Hi JJ:

That's EXACTLY to what I was referring!!!

You couldn't have provided a better example!!

What a waste of an archive!!!

Dave Keller