Furloughs?

I'm recently retired in July 09 as conductor. I've heard a rumor, not a good one, that some conductors or engineers are being furloughed. I remember the last one in 1984. At least there were temporary alternate positions available if one desired. Many had families to feed. I heard there are none now. Can anyone confirm this?

What you heard is true. Unless someone has seniority in a crafty he can return to, the Railroad has said there are no other positions for laid off employees. The Railroad is also adamant that this would be a lay-off not a furlough; that not all laid off employees would eventually be hired back.

This is if the State Legislature does not increase taxes to give the MTA the millions that it is seeking. I believe the date we are looking at is sometime in April.

The last time Conductors were furloughed, was probably the great depression, if at all.
Engineers were furloughed in the late 70's or early 80's due to the RR hiring too many of them.
Most were offered positions in other departments, until needed as Engineers.
The situation today is different.
Unless the state or federal government comes up with money, there will be layoffs.
The CTA in Chicago just furloughed 1100 workers.
This is no joke.
The economy is as bad as its ever been.
Remember that in November.
As far as not hiring back some workers, if they are past their probation period, by contract they have to be hired back first before new people can be hired.

I could be wrong but i was under the assumption that there is a clause in the union contracts that states the RR has to hire back any furloughed employee's first when they begin hiring new employee's again, how can they get around this? assuming the person furloughed had no discipline problems.
I would also think it would be cheaper to bring back someone who is already trained and knows how to do the job as opposed to someone off the street. and i know what you will say, the employee they don't want back is a thief / liar / cheat etc and we want someone new. but i ask you this, since the RR did such a great job hiring the last group of employee's (not my opinion i am re-stating what has been said) what makes you think the next round of 'new' employee's won't be carbon copies of the ones they want to lay off??

A good friend of mine in the LIRR Signal Dept. told me about engineers getting laid-off. He was quite taken aback by that, to say the least. He also said there's been no talk of trimming the administrative fat at LIRR headquarters in Jamaica or over at Hillside, just the muscle out in the field. Typical...

Recalling employees that are laid-off is dependant on their respective union agreements. The Engineers union has specific language regarding lay-offs requiring employees be cut "in reverse of seniority" and recalled "in seniority order". If the UTU does not have specific language similar to the BLET, then the Railroad may not have to recall those that are cut. We are researching the Railway Labor Act and Federal labor law regarding this subject.

ADL, very nice post. All of your posts as a matter of fact, especially the one ratting out your senior brothers and sisters being AWOL. I especially enjoyed your post about you being in that uniform "long after I am dead and buried". That's great news that someone like you will be toiling away in that job while I am enjoying a fruitful and generous retirement, one by the way, you will never have like me. I will think about you as I am travelling and playing golf. Please keep working so I and others like me get paid. Thank you!

Steamboat, I read your posts on this site and realized that you don't even work for the LIRR and are maybe a "railroader" as you have styled yourself, for maybe a year, two at most. What I forgot about this business, you will probably never learn. You will spend your days collecting tickets and opening doors watching real railroad people passing you on a freight and you wishing you were just like them and yet will never be.

Mark, may I suggest that your posts are shorter so that all the hard work you put in to them are read by others and not just the first sentence or two.

well, yeah, i still have to work 20-25 years while you can retire now if you wanted. of course i will still be here while you are playing golf. my pension might not be as big as yours but remember, i also have my 401K to build up for 30 years unlike you, so i am not worried. I will enjoy a long and fruitfull retirement as well. at least with you gone we will have some people running this place with an ounce of competence.

if you value the taxpayers so much maybe you would consider forfeting some of your generous pension back to the state??

Datenail wrote:Recalling employees that are laid-off is dependant on their respective union agreements. The Engineers union has specific language regarding lay-offs requiring employees be cut "in reverse of seniority" and recalled "in seniority order". If the UTU does not have specific language similar to the BLET, then the Railroad may not have to recall those that are cut. We are researching the Railway Labor Act and Federal labor law regarding this subject.

ADL, very nice post. All of your posts as a matter of fact, especially the one ratting out your senior brothers and sisters being AWOL. I especially enjoyed your post about you being in that uniform "long after I am dead and buried". That's great news that someone like you will be toiling away in that job while I am enjoying a fruitful and generous retirement, one by the way, you will never have like me. I will think about you as I am travelling and playing golf. Please keep working so I and others like me get paid. Thank you!

Steamboat, I read your posts on this site and realized that you don't even work for the LIRR and are maybe a "railroader" as you have styled yourself, for maybe a year, two at most. What I forgot about this business, you will probably never learn. You will spend your days collecting tickets and opening doors watching real railroad people passing you on a freight and you wishing you were just like them and yet will never be.

Mark, may I suggest that your posts are shorter so that all the hard work you put in to them are read by others and not just the first sentence or two.

shouldn't you be hard at work (with your vast knowledge and expertise of Railroading operations) checking every employee's facebook page for things that might hurt the feelings of the LIRR instead of posting nonsense on RR.net ??

LongIslandTool wrote:What you heard is true. Unless someone has seniority in a crafty he can return to, the Railroad has said there are no other positions for laid off employees. The Railroad is also adamant that this would be a lay-off not a furlough; that not all laid off employees would eventually be hired back.

This is if the State Legislature does not increase taxes to give the MTA the millions that it is seeking. I believe the date we are looking at is sometime in April.

I don't see very much public support for higher taxes to prop up the MTA, so unless there is a second Federal stimulus, it's hard to see where the money is going to come from? Short of renegotiating the union agreements, which is nearly impossible, it seems unlikely that the MTA will be able to accomplish significant savings through the planned service reductions.

Thank you ADL for your typical response. Good luck with your 401k, considering the lack of intellect in your posts, would show how miserable your investment skills must be. Did you sit in the cab today and read a newspaper because you didn't feel like collecting? Did you deliberately rip your pants so you could go home early? Jealous us "old folks" have a better deal than you and all you can do is write on Railroad.Net about how senior train service employees can do what they want and some wanna-be old guy like you can't? Heck of a union man you are. Go and cry now that you can't get your way and nobody will care. Earn your stripes young man like the rest of us did. You talk of never getting an AWOL, which isn't suprising since you have a job where you don't have to show up and nobody would know because the train will simply go without you. Which is not unnoticed by the MTA by the way. Now, I respect what a Conductor has pertaining to responsibility and training, but to write on here like your in a brotherhood and then cry publicly about how your union members that are senior to you get away with more, smacks of how much of a hypocrate you really are. If this current climate and management of the LIRR bothers you so much, then quit.

I find it interesting as well that date is such an important member of the RR, yet finds time to play on his computer while at work, while the professionals are out running the railroad.
Reminds me of the times I had to talk to supervision in NY and they were all playing golf on their computers against each other, while the RR was running without them.

I don't know what the plans are, but aren't furloughs going to cause overtime to increase? Last summer jobs were blanked all the time. I know there seem to be some plan to reduce jobs, but has the railroad accepted overtime increases instead of paying benefits?

The plan is to drastically cut jobs on the trains.

Virtually no trainman today collects his pay in cash, so the MTA views the employ of collectors, brakemen and conductors as a waste of money. In other words, it's cheaper to not collect fares than to employ people to collect them.

Upcoming rule book changes will further reduce the on-train staffing requirements. While I disagree with much of DateNail's philosophy, it is difficult for the union to argue with the principle that if every trainman stayed home the trains would still run. Now I'm not jumping on the DateNail bandwagon, but this is the argument that is raised by the Chairman every day.

I was just wondering is the new MTA chairman intending to implement these changes on Metro North as well as the LIRR, it seems like the MTA is really targeting the LIRR but this is just from what I have seen... I could be wrong.....any input on this

NJT has also spoken of furloughs, based upon a shortfall of 200 million for FY 2010.

And what of the M of E crafts ? It is well-known that the railroad is kind of heavy on machinists.

SS