Copper Wire?

I too enjoy Patrick's blog posts. If his posts are inaccurate, feel free to post corrections. We're all interested in getting more information.

One of reasons railroad do not like to elaborate on copper theft, is because it gives new thieves new ideas as to where copper can be obtained.

used to be a real LIRR insider posting info here befor you cursed him out. He got lots of us our jobs here. I smell envy, boys!

Lirr 42, dont be too concerned about what they say. Keep posting your blog if you wish. I was a LIRR Conductor for almost 34 years.
Its just envy on their part. The 2 or 3 that were on you don't even work for the LIRR, so take what they say with a grain of salt. All their info is second hand too.
I read your blog too occasionally.
The ones that are on your back have a history of putting down others too, just let it roll off your back. They never ever have a nice word for anyone. Just the way it is.

To answer the question what is being cut are the impedance bond cables at track circuit boundaries. Impedance bonds are a form of electrical filter that allows one type of current to pass while blocking another. In the case of the LIRR the current they wish to have pass is DC return traction current which runs from the train back to the substation. What they don't want to have pass are 100Hz AC coded track circuit current which detects and transmits cab signal codes to trains in the block.

The impedance bond cables are quite thick to handle the high amperage DC traction return current. When cut the signal system will interpret both blocks on either side of the stripped bonds to be occupied requiring trains to traverse them at 20mph. Blocks are two miles long so what would normally take 3 minutes to traverse would now take 12. The reduction in capacity causes a bottleneck and before long you have 30 minute delays. That's also assuming they only hit a single impedance bond location.

Remember the m-7 derailment a few months ago? Didnt they mention impedence bonds as a contributing factor to that delrilment??

I enjoy your blog as well lirr42.

srock68 wrote:I enjoy your blog as well lirr42.

Ditto.

Doc Emmet Brown wrote:The 2 or 3 that were on you don't even work for the LIRR, so take what they say with a grain of salt. All their info is second hand too.

Not for nothing even if they did work for the LIRR chances are their info would be second hand. I doubt there is some notice to all employees every time there is an incident that delays trains. At Metro North there isn't. This means most of the info given by word of mouth. We know what happens then.

When there is an incident that delays trains on the LIRR, Crews are notified by supervision, Train Orders, or cell phone, or the towers.
Most have knowledge of whats going on.
They want the crews to keep the passengers informed.
In addition, when something big happens, such as the colin furgeson shootings, or the incident at woodside in 2006 involving the gap incident, The people that were there are spoken too by other crews personally.
For example, I know everyone on those crews, and have spoken to all of them at one time or another.
(small example, only one of the people on the furgeson train is still working on the RR, the rest are retired, it will be 20 years on Dec 7th. An outsider would not know that)
A person who does not work for the LIRR does not have the info that an employee does. Thats all.
An outsider knows what they read in the paper, which is not always accurate.

Gentlemen, can we keep this topic on track and not discuss unrelated items please?

Doc Emmet, believe me I am not under any circumstances envious of someone of your stature. You are a paramount example of what not to be. I've seen you over the years both in the employ as well as post-employment with the RR. I've noticed 2 trends here whenever the people involved in a discussion have a disagreement. You hoist yourself on the pedestal as some kind of RR god. Also worth mentioning is whenever it nears the end of the month, historically you have gone into the deep end. Makes me wonder if you ran out of money for your medication.

In closing, lirr42 for the record I do enjoy most of your posts on RR.net as a whole because you do participate on other forums. I have also read your blog. Just be a little more mindful of over-advertising it, because like I said it doesn't have official MTA backing. And DRN is right, copper theft is a serious issue of any railroad. Discussion of such sensitive matter especially on a public discussion forum may not be a great idea.

Steamboat Willie wrote:Doc Emmet, believe me I am not under any circumstances envious of someone of your stature. You are a paramount example of what not to be. I've seen you over the years both in the employ as well as post-employment with the RR. I've noticed 2 trends here whenever the people involved in a discussion have a disagreement. You hoist yourself on the pedestal as some kind of RR god. Also worth mentioning is whenever it nears the end of the month, historically you have gone into the deep end. Makes me wonder if you ran out of money for your medication.

In closing, lirr42 for the record I do enjoy most of your posts on RR.net as a whole because you do participate on other forums. I have also read your blog. Just be a little more mindful of over-advertising it, because like I said it doesn't have official MTA backing. And DRN is right, copper theft is a serious issue of any railroad. Discussion of such sensitive matter especially on a public discussion forum may not be a great idea.

I gather the Post: "... by Liquidcamphor » Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:02 pm Gentlemen, can we keep this topic on track and not discuss unrelated items please?.." has no value. Therefore:

When Doc and I disagreed many months back it was over the posting of photos without credits, for example. But, the thread did not discuss our mental/physical health/home life/etc. The "medication statement" above is totally out of school.

IMHO: LIRR42, should not have to be told how to promote his blog; especially twice. It is not a commercial enterprise, thus is it really advertising? So what it doesn't have MTA backing? If that was the case a hundred sites would disappear, for example: http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/LIRRCommuters/ Do those folks give a hoot about MTA official backing?

Should I curtail mentioning: http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirr/lirrcontents.htm as the LIRR/MTA never provided official backing?

To: Liquidcamphor, Yes, guilty as charged as being off topic.

DutchRailnut wrote:One of reasons railroad do not like to elaborate on copper theft, is because it gives new thieves new ideas as to where copper can be obtained.

For years they kept quiet about suicides in the subways. I understand those are up this year, but the world has changed. People have smart phones. People tweet. People see things and say it straight to the internet. The cat, if you will, is out of the bag. Everyone knows what an announcement of a 'police investigation' means. (this morning the 7 wasn't going into manhattan - 'police investigation' - I didn't have to bother reading the news blogs to know someone was under a train). We can only wait and see if suicides trend higher in the coming years as a result. If they do, that's something society should deal with somehow, not try to hide it and pretend it's not happening.

The same will hold true of copper, only to a smaller degree. There is no hiding it. People will find out, blogs will report it, workers will tell friends who post on twitter, etc etc. The word will get out every single time, even if the press never reports on it.

I don't think the general public knowing about it is really going to encourage the practice much. 'Scrappers' stick to abandoned out of the way places for the most part. There are more than enough video cameras around MTA property these days to catch some of them. Plus there's the whole darwin aspect of messing with MTA wires that most scrappers I doubt want any part of.

On the flip side, if people know copper theft is a serious crime, and they see someone walking out of a station carrying armloads of copper, they'll maybe think to call 911.

Liquidcamphor, Doc deserves an apology if not censure "Steamboat Willie". Doc, no doubt about it you ARE a railroad god. Your career, experience and ability to remember it and share it with the rest of us is invaluable and priceless. Would you consider writing a "blog", whatever that is ??? (I wonder if I ever waved to you when I used to hang around WIN tower before it burned down at Easter 1977? I was very friendly with "Big Ed" 2nd trick operator who then became Train Director at Harold.) Keep on trucking Doc...(by train!!!)