Waterbury Branch Thread

[NH2060]

What should definitely be included in that list is anything pertaining to Devon Jct.

The yard is never used by MN, its strictly PanAm railroad, ...
... Use of yard would require same as passing the Division post, permission from other railroad, and would be same operating rules " restricted speed as its both considered yard trackage.

One of the short list of alternatives for improvements on the branch includes creating a 5 track yard at this location for Metro North to store trains. I don't see it as a high priority though. If CDOT can actually get signals operational and one passing siding built in the next 10 years, it would be a major accomplishment.

In the meantime, as a result of comments heard at the recent forums, the Commuter Rail Council has sent four specific recommendations to the CDOT commissioner. They are:

1. An additional stop in South Norwalk for #1923 to allow for easier connection to Danbury Branch.

2. Have additional trains make Stratford stops to encourage additional riders.

3. Have the train that deadheads from Stamford to Bridgeport to become #1948 make stops between Stamford and Bridgeport.

4. Add additional weekend service to eliminate the 3 – 4 hour service gap. (Apparently, Sunday has the highest daily ridership and Saturday is at the same levels as M-F.)

The Council is hoping that some of these recommendations can be incorporated into the November schedule change.

Bill

5 tracks does sound a lot, especially considering that Wassaic has 12-13+ round trips and has a 4 track yard (that's primarily used to store the Maxis in the evening/early morning).

A stop at SoNo sounds like a stretch given that so many other trains already stop there and can be connected to @ Bridgeport.

Would timing even permit additional Stratford stops? I agree that it could/would encourage additional riders, but it would either involve 1) holding up track 1 longer for WB trains or 2) holding up tracks 1, 3, and 2 all at once to allow NB trains to cross over.

If the deadhead run could back into Stamford to pick up passengers and just run express to Bridgeport that would still be an improvement.

Extra weekend service? That I can see happening though probably not more than 1-2 additional trains.

What needs to get more attention is Devon Jct. The cries for more frequencies are obviously there, but it looks like they won't get anything more than at most 10-12 RTs or so unless that gets built.

I wonder if part of the reason for having the sets based in Stamford now instead of New Haven was to make the concept of Stamford-Waterbury through service (and on a regular basis) more feasible?

But, as noted...those are planning assumptions for the Central CT study, not the Waterbury Branch improvements study. Wrong place to be stuffing that wish list item, CDOT.

Perhaps trying to slip it in there would help give Waterbury-Hartford more leverage/exposure? Certainly the possibility of trains running end to end to/from Hartford can't be out of the question.

wait a minute!! Hartford to Waterbury ???? but we just converted part of that right of way for Malloys Bus way ??

And in 10-20 years it just may get converted back to rail after several winters of shotty service and unhappy riders if the inclement slows the busses down enough This isn't street running after all this is on what is essentially a road. And a road in winter is no match for snowstorms.

[runningwithscalpels]

Allegedly it was to improve reliability - it does seem like I get less bustitution emails these days.

It is kind of pointless for them to run a Stamford-Bridgeport deadhead when they could be picking up passengers. As for weekend service, one later train probably wouldn't kill them - that last train is always a zoo. Weekday level service shouldn't be too difficult for them to run, but even just that one train would be super helpful I think.

[Bill D]

Allegedly it was to improve reliability - it does seem like I get less bustitution emails these days.

It was stated at the Naugatuck forum that mechanical failures were down 25% since the change to basing the equipment in Stamford.

It is kind of pointless for them to run a Stamford-Bridgeport deadhead when they could be picking up passengers.

While I feel this is a good idea, the question I have is, how do you handle a late connecting train from GCT? At present, the Waterbury set can just hold in the yard, and then follow the through train up to Bridgeport for the transfer. If it becomes a train originating at Stamford, and the connection is running late, do you hold it in the yard and then try to get it to the Stamford platform without disrupting other service, or do you just run it at the scheduled time out of Stamford and forget about the connection? (Which will not sit well with passengers coming up from New York)

As for weekend service, one later train probably wouldn't kill them - that last train is always a zoo. Weekday level service shouldn't be too difficult for them to run, but even just that one train would be super helpful I think.

While there is the cost factor, improved weekend service would be a worthwhile investment. With weekend ridership the same or higher than weekday levels, there is certainly justification for weekday level service.

Bill what good would a 5 track yard do ??
trains will not stay overnight as there is no MofE forces or facilities in Waterbury to service or inspect the trains.
CDOT does not have sufficient diesel equipment, to run more than two trains and has made no attempt to buy more.

I believe that this and many of the other proposals in the report are based on computer simulations, using various service and ridership levels, and not on real world scenarios. To add the missing elements that you point out would involve a significant capital investment, as well as operating costs. Maybe in 10 years or so (and after a few more studies) the issue will be revisited.

What should definitely be included in that list is anything pertaining to Devon Jct.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Passengers want better service to stations along the main line without transfers, but they also want more frequent service, which may ultimately mean transferring at Devon. If it comes down to a choice, which will it be?

Bill

[Backshophoss]

With the East Bridgeport yard rebuild,there was mention of a fuel pad to to kill off the deadheading to New Haven then,
now Stamford for fuel. Or has that project been "mothballed" due to funding redirection?

Get the "Mothership"(ESPN) to pay for "their" station stop in Bristol,they throw $$$ around like wash water anyway.

[DutchRailnut]

putting in a fuel pad is a long process and won't be done, EPA, enviromental reviews , catch basins , fuel water seperator plant etc etc.
hardest part is to put train at location where MofE forces with knowledge of diesel equipment is located.
one of most valid gripes about New Haven was despite train going to terminal with toilet servicing, it hardly ever got serviced and on Waterbury train it usually stunk like a toilet on a tuna trawler.

[runningwithscalpels]

HA! Jaap for the win about the Waterbury potties.

[Steamboat Willie]

I would be surprised if they moved the Waterbury jobs back to New Haven at the change of time. It was noted there has been a 25% reduction of service failures since the jobs went to Stamford. New Haven has enough on its plate and is a major repair facility for MNR. And the RR likes that they can interchange with Danbury train sets. Plus, engine swaps are quicker if need be.

A quick fix I see happening would be having 1948 originate at Stamford to receive passengers and possibly adding another round trip on the weekend. Equipment is more readily available on the weekend but it all depends on the funding CDOT allows for it.

[RearOfSignal]

putting in a fuel pad is a long process and won't be done, EPA, enviromental reviews , catch basins , fuel water seperator plant etc etc.
hardest part is to put train at location where MofE forces with knowledge of diesel equipment is located.
one of most valid gripes about New Haven was despite train going to terminal with toilet servicing, it hardly ever got serviced and on Waterbury train it usually stunk like a toilet on a tuna trawler.

Not if they put in all fuel pad like they have in NWP and have truck come in to fuel. Being as close as it is to the Bronx River, I can't imagine a fuel pad in Bridgeport would be that difficult, unless CT has more stringent requirements.

[DutchRailnut]

watch what you say, some locations used for fueling might not be up to code.

[Ridgefielder]

putting in a fuel pad is a long process and won't be done, EPA, enviromental reviews , catch basins , fuel water seperator plant etc etc.
hardest part is to put train at location where MofE forces with knowledge of diesel equipment is located.
one of most valid gripes about New Haven was despite train going to terminal with toilet servicing, it hardly ever got serviced and on Waterbury train it usually stunk like a toilet on a tuna trawler.

Not if they put in all fuel pad like they have in NWP and have truck come in to fuel. Being as close as it is to the Bronx River, I can't imagine a fuel pad in Bridgeport would be that difficult, unless CT has more stringent requirements.

NWP is probably grandfathered. Haven't there been locomotive servicing facilities there the since the initial GCT-NWP electrification in ca. 1907?

[DutchRailnut]

yard has since that time rebuild a few times, so no it would not be grand fathered.

[Bill D]

Another "improvement" at the Waterbury train station. The city has just been approved for a $14.4 million TIGER Grant, to create bike - pedestrian trails and local street improvements. Part of this grant is proposed to be used to create a connector from the (proposed) Naugatuck River greenway to the train station and Library Park. Here is a quote from the preliminary conceptual plan:

"It would require the construction of a new signature footbridge from the top of Library Park over Meadow Street and then ramp down to the railway ROW. The trail would then cross at an at grade crossing of the active commuter rail line and continue on to intersect with a new multi-use path that runs between the train station and park. This multi–use trail would be constructed on abandoned rail tracks and run on the west side of the active rail lines and be separated from it by a fence, green space and trees. It will also connect directly with the revitalized train station by way of an at-grade pedestrian crossing of the active tracks."

So we have proposals to create a small storage yard for expanded service, as well as the possibility of Waterbury - Hartford service, and now to make things even more interesting, let's have pedestrians and bicyclists crossing the tracks at grade. (There will also be parallel pedestrian and bicycle friendly paths along Freight Street, just north of the station that will serve the same purpose.) Way to go Waterbury!

Bill

Link to Greenway connector documents: http://www.waterburyct.org/TIGER

[DutchRailnut]

wow a tiger grant for potential trespassers, I see little in service improvements , what a waste of money.

[Bill D]

wow a tiger grant for potential trespassers, I see little in service improvements , what a waste of money.

It gets deeper. The so called improvements include: "When complete, the project will increase the access of city residents to jobs outside of the city, enabling thousands of people in predominantly minority and low-income neighborhoods to reach mass transit services." (From the U.S. DOT press release: http://www.dot.gov/briefing-room/us-tra ... build-bike)

The minority and low-income neighborhoods are presently well served by mass transit. This is just the latest "vision" for resurrecting Waterbury. It has no coordination with other plans, such as the rail line improvements, proposed intermodal hub or the rebuilding of the I-84 / Route 8 interchange. Many more dollars will be wasted before it is all done.

Bill

[NH2060]

Since this appears to be the result of Mr. Donnarumma's post @ MNR here are the results of the recently added late night weekend trains (Brief fair use quote below):

The Republican-American reports the total number of riders is about 160 on the additional trains during an average weekend, or 30 more than what Metro-North initially projected.

http://wtnh.com/2015/01/06/2-new-waterb ... ridership/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;