Visiting Philly, Just a few questions about SEPTA

I'm planning on visiting Philadelphia in about a week and would like to photograph some of the SEPTA system, mostly the above ground portions. I've been to Philadelphia once before about 5 years ago but wasnt as much of a traction fan back then.
I'd really appreciate it if someone could answer just a few questions...

Where is Elmwood depot? I'd really like to see the PCC-IIs.

Is the overhead still up for the Electric Trolley bus system and where are the abandoned ETBs kept?

Is the SEPTA store still open on Market Street in the SEPTA HQ?


thanks!!

pdxstreetcar wrote:I'm planning on visiting Philadelphia in about a week and would like to photograph some of the SEPTA system, mostly the above ground portions. I've been to Philadelphia once before about 5 years ago but wasnt as much of a traction fan back then.
I'd really appreciate it if someone could answer just a few questions...

Where is Elmwood depot? I'd really like to see the PCC-IIs.

73rd & Elmwood in Southwest Philly. You can ride the rt 36 trolley and get off there. The PCCIIs are kept in the back for the most part. You can see them if ya walk down 73rd to the end at Grays Av.

Is the overhead still up for the Electric Trolley bus system and where are the abandoned ETBs kept?

Yep and the coches are kept behind Midvale Depot which is right behind Wayne Jct RRD station.

Is the SEPTA store still open on Market Street in the SEPTA HQ?

Yup


thanks!! [/quote]

If you're looking for traction systems, don't forget the Route 101/102 trolleys and the Route 100 high-speed line (ex-P&W) out of Upper Darby.

They're below ground part way, but the subway-surface lines are interesting esp. since they sometimes give a jolt to visitors who don't expect to find a trolley running in a tunnel.

Thanks SEPTALRV9072 & JeffK!!!

How is SEPTA regarding photography? Do they mind if you take a simple snapshot of a trolley or train from inside a subway station?

Ya make get a couple of dirty looks from employees and riders alike but that's about it. SEPTA really doesn't care about photography.

JeffK wrote:
They're below ground part way, but the subway-surface lines are interesting esp. since they sometimes give a jolt to visitors who don't expect to find a trolley running in a tunnel.

The Route 36, mentioned in an earlier post, is a Subway-Surface Route. So you can kill two stones with one bird--- you can experience the subway-surface lines and find the PCC II cars.

Railfan/photographers were screamed at and threatened by SEPTA police at the 8th & Market Ridge Ave station on December 29. [I was entering the PATCO station at the time.]

http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/SEPT ... 4_12_29_96

They were part of a group that had been riding and photographing SEPTA all day without incident.

http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/SEPT ... 4_12_29_55

http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/SEPT ... eys?page=7

chuchubob wrote:Railfan/photographers were screamed at and threatened by SEPTA police at the 8th & Market Ridge Ave station on December 29. [I was entering the PATCO station at the time.]

It's a miracle you even see a SEPTA "rent-a-cop" [according to ctrabs74]. They're just like the Philly cops, nowhere to be found except at a donut shop!

Mdlbigcat wrote:It's a miracle you even see a SEPTA "rent-a-cop" [according to ctrabs74]. They're just like the Philly cops, nowhere to be found except at a donut shop!

Ah, I love stereotypes -- it's funny to note which ones people will actually consider funny while still being incredibly offensive and degrading (you know, like thinking all railfans spend their lives with their toy trains in the garage, wearing engineer's garb while making train noises and calling out his/her imaginary/replicated stations). I never go 3 days riding SEPTA without seeing a SEPTA cop (which means they must be getting around, since there are many more SEPTA vehicles than cops), and I see a Philadelphia policeperson no less than every other day. As someone who recently had the misfortune of getting his car stolen, I had a lot of dealing with Philly cops, and I must give them HIGH (significantly higher than any suburban ones I've dealt with) marks for response time, concern, and going-above-and-beyond-ness in recovering it.

But I digress... this is a SEPTA forum, not a Philadelphia one... so on to the "rent-a-cop" statement.

I have news for you -- SEPTA police are, in fact, just that: police. They go to police academy. They can arrest you. Their tickets on your car windshield matter. The only difference between a SEPTA police officer and one from any town is their jurisdiction. Rather than being assigned to a municipality, SEPTA police have power on SEPTA property (although I imagine they have agreements with towns that SEPTA runs in, like Philly, so that they can actually pursue someone off a bus). SEPTA police are NOT mall security.

A couple of points...

1. I've lived and fanned in Philly awhile and thus far (despite the hyper-vigilance of the post-Nine-Eleven mindset) have had no problems photographing transit equipment. (Bob, sorry you guys got hassled, but let's face it, you fellas look like the James Gang. Nice pix.)

2. Philly is home to a diverse array of rail equipment...check out the A5 cars on the Rt 100, the Kawasaki's on subway-surface, Patco across to Jersey, Silverliners on Regional Rail. Lots of stuff to see. Septa.org has downloadable pdf files of route maps... easy enough to cross reference against a street map.

3. Septa Police. Yes, they are "real cops" (as compared to private security or "mall cops"). Months of scanner listening have revealed that they seem to perform a core of basic duties to keep things running smoothly:

a. Finding lost baggage. Commuters, in their hazy dreamstate, often leave their bags on trains. Crews often turn them in to Septa police, or Septa police board trains to look for lost items. Not a glam job, it's true, but does prevent having to call out the bomb-sniffing dogs every time a sleepy yupster leaves his briefacse aboard the R5.

b. Identifying illegally parked vehicles. Watch where you park. These guys get a fair amount of cars towed, and they do run plate checks.

c. Rousting winos from the Concourse. A big job in winter...lots of cold winos seeking shelter and only a handful of cops. I know this keeps the concourse more pleasant for Septa riders, and I really don't sense that the Septa cops take any pleasure in turning the poor out into the cold. Sadly, a defect of the shelter system, not Septa.

d. Addressing vandalism. Here's where I've really heard Septa police make a difference. I can't tell you how many weekends some pork-brains put objects on the tracks. Septa cops drive out along the Regional Rail system, find the trouble spots called in by train crews, ensure that the track is clear, and (if possible) arrest the vandals responsible.

* * *

pdx- Enjoy your visit to Philly. And remember, if somebody gives you the finger, don't be alarmed, it's just their way of saying hello.

-Urban
in the City of Brotherly Love

Two days ago as part of my goal to ride every regional rail, I went to Philly and rode both Chestnut Hill branches as well as Fox Chase. No hassles. I'd definately reccomened doing that. The "West" is an ex Pennsy line. Get off at Chestnut Hill West and make a left once you go up the steps and then at the light, make a right and walk downhill. the Chestnut Hill East ex-Reading terminal is on the right. You could even ride up to Doylestown. Lots of rural scenery beyond Lansdale. You might want to treat yourself to an Amtrak ride out to Harrisburg. They lowered the fares on that line completely to "commuterlike fares." A word of caution which I'm sure you know. Stay away from anywhere in N. Philly. The neighborhoods are bad. Remember, if asked to leave by septa cops, please do so just like transit or mta. You don't want jail to be apart of your trip. You are not with a group of drunk college students. Philly gives you an assortment of railroads.

Urban D Kaye wrote:A couple of points...

1. I've lived and fanned in Philly awhile and thus far (despite the hyper-vigilance of the post-Nine-Eleven mindset) have had no problems photographing transit equipment. (Bob, sorry you guys got hassled, but let's face it, you fellas look like the James Gang. Nice pix.)

As I mentioned, the guys got hassled as I was leaving. That was Dec 29. On Jan 2 I was photographing SEPTA, NJT and Amtrak at Trenton station with two other guys. As I was leaving I passed a gang of NJT cops going the other way. They hassled the heck out of my buddies.

Bottom line: anybody photographing trains with me should leave when I do!

http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/SEPTA/05_01_02_29

Bob

Bob -

Sorry, was just joking. But I definitely do see the wisdom in the travel-light-and-leave-quickly school of thought.

Last January, I had the pleasure of sampling Philly's rails (commuter, subway, and trolley) with a group of other fans. There were about a dozen of us, nearly all with cameras. On a weekend, such a group invariably draws some curious glances. Frankly, folks seemed to be trying to determine whether we were foreign dignitaries or refugees from the Special Olympics. Fortunately we had no troubles about photography, but only because we saw no cops (transit or otherwise). I'm sure we would have drawn at least a few questions.

So, except for special excursions, I tend to fan alone...arrive on foot...get my photos...and leave.

-Urban

No offense was taken, Urban. I agree with the characterization.

Look at the gang with whom I railfanned on Monday:
http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/Metr ... 5_01_17_04

I'm quite sorry you didn't get my sarcasm, but considering the way transit cops are acting these days, they deserve the scorn heaped upon them by railfans and the members of the public. I know the threat of terrorism is quite real, but hassling photographers is not the way to protect their transit systems. Any smart terrorist ALREADY knows what to blow up, gas, etc, and some foamer, kid, or old dude with a camera wanting to take a picture of a train should not be subjected to the paranoia of officials.

Finally, in order to survive in Philadelphia, [with all of the BS that goes on around here] you have to be a sarcastic jerk.