Train delay: 8 locomotives stand in way of rail car expansio

From:
http://www.norwalkadvocate.com/news/local/scn-sa-
nor.commuter3dec16,0,2070965.story?coll=nor-news-local-headlines

Train delay: 8 locomotives stand in way of rail car expansion

By Mark Ginocchio
Staff Writer

December 16, 2004

STAMFORD -- The state's plan to add 2,000 seats to the New Haven
Line before the end of the year hit a snag because more locomotives
are needed, state Department of Transportation officials told
commuters last night.

About eight diesel locomotives must be purchased to pull the rail
cars the state bought earlier this year from Virginia, said Peter
Richter, interim assistant rail administrator for the DOT's Bureau
of Public Transportation.

"We're looking to put these trains into service as soon as
possible," Richter said at the Connecticut Rail Commuter Council
meeting in Stamford. "But there are still a lot of moves left to be
made."

In September, DOT officials predicted the 26 used Virginia Railway
Express cars, which cost a total of $14 million, wouldn't be put in
service until February because they needed to be inspected and
refurbished.

About those P40's ??? Their price would be probably $150k or more.

Conndot has 12 non dual-modes(6 GP40-2h and 6 FL-9m) for branch lines and SLE. All 12 were totaly rebuilt from the ground up 1996. The Amtrak P40's were built in 1996 but have about 2 1/2 million miles on them.
What ConnDOT needs is Dual modes, not single modes. MNCR has agreed not to run diesels in revenue service into GCT, so why would they need P40's ???

Currently MNCR operates 4 shuttle trains on Branches and has 8 FL9's(6 ConnDOT FL9m and 2 MNCR units) plus 3 F10's.

So we have 11 F units to cover 4 assignments ????
but we need to buy more single modes ????

What ever $ is left over is ample to start ordering dual modes from GE.

I think there is a pretty high minimum order for GE, 15 or something maybe, and I doubt the state can afford that many.

I read this article this morning in the paper and thought about posting here, but it looked like some usual poor Stamford Advocate reporting so I held off. Personally, it seems like they just said a bunch of stuff to please everyone. I don't see how all of a sudden CDOT has "no problem" getting funding for new locomotives, unless they are looking at using some of the surplus, but next year we have a billion dollar deficit planned already so I just can't see the state being so willing to spend on much. I'm also surprised it took this long for an article to come out like this, it's been well known that new equipment is needed to pull these cars.

Out of the 60 million dollar emergency funding to buy 2000 seats, only 14 million is spend on the VRE cars(2700 seats), leaving 46 million for locomotives and rebuilding of the VRE's.

The Dual modes run at about $5 million a piece, but are currently not in production.

GE wants a minimum commitment of 15 units I believe to start production.

The P40's, despite a price of maybe $150k would need a major overhaul, since Amtrak put them away before their next overhaul cycle. Amtrak travels a lot of Miles in 8 years. These P40 units are the same age as the FL-9m's who were rebuilt by Morrisson Knutson in 1996 from the ground up.

M-K did a great job, not like the first 4 Chrome units who were mainly cab refurbishments and paint job.

The M-K's have lots of new structural steel, total rewiring, new engines/generators/tractionmotors/Caterpillar HEP etc.

Hi All,

Jaap's right! Whats the point of buying P-40's? Those NH FL-9m's and MN F-units can cover all the routes not going into GCT, like all the shuttle trains. Then the DM Genesis could Only be used on GCT trains. Thanks for the good comments about the FL-9m's as they are VERY nice and cost alot of $ only a few years ago!! Hopefully CDOT will keep them around till they are 20 years old, atleast get there moneys worth out of the rebuild. BTW- What engine is in the FL-9m's now, EMD 645?

-Barry

Not to take this thread off topic, P40s should be bought for their eventual use on the Springfield line, provided the cost of refurbishing them doesn't defeat the bargain of buying these units.

Aww come on. Hartford/Springfield commuter service has been talked about for so long, it's bound to happen. Though IMHO it's a stupid idea - the region needs more of a setup like the RiverLINE running around the immediate Hartford area than what's being proposed now, which IMHO is like using a sledgehammer to drive a tack....

Someone refresh my knowledge. To run into GCT you need a train that can be powered (Traction and HEP) off underunning 650Volt third rail. And the locomotive has to have some sort of nose door and or hatch for the engineer to bail out of in am emergency. Am I correct?

Can the Amtrak P32AC-DM units be refitted with diferent thrid rail shoes? But even if you could, does the lack of a nopse door escape bar them from GCT?

I am not even going to atempt to speculate if a LIRR DM30AC could be converted.

We all know thew old FL9A units are no longer duel modes.

Where do the FL9AC units stand? Why were these rebuilt new units sidelined? Cant someone take the ten of them, and make 6 to 8 running ones?

The FL9ac's were side lined because of reliability problems. there are only 7 built that would work with bombardier cars and one was wrecked in a rock slide. leaving only 6.
The LIRR FL9ac's are completly differend controls and electrical hookups and have N2a electric couplers on rear , The LIRR units may be included in scrap contract currently happening in east yard in Croton North.
One LIRR unit was completely stripped after falling in turntable pit at morris park shops years ago.

<i>One LIRR unit was completely stripped after falling in turntable pit at morris park shops years ago.</i>

That the infamous 'Whoops! No air!" incident someone told me about a while back?

Which was the same engine that was crashed by the rear of the old P72 equipment, and ran off the tracks in the east end of Port Jefferson yard years back before the famous running off the turntable. That was the 301 the original NH 2000.

Nasadowsk wrote:<i>One LIRR unit was completely stripped after falling in turntable pit at morris park shops years ago.</i>

That the infamous 'Whoops! No air!" incident someone told me about a while back?

The FL9-ACs were deceptive. With most diesels, if the engine is running, the compressor is pumping air. Not true on the FL9-ACs with their electric pumps. They had to be running at a high idle in HEP mode for the compressor to be on. The hand brake was located back in the engine compartment. If you went inside and released the hand brake without checking the air first, you were in trouble! Not sure if that's what happened at Morris Park, but the potential was there.

As "Dutch" has noted here many times, the FL9-ACs were a pleasure to run. They accelerated well out of stations and had a good dynamic brake with regenerative capability (power was put back into the HEP bus, but not back into the third rail for safety reasons).

Good grief.... the HEP has to be on for the Air compressor to work?
How do you double head these then? You cant have both HEPs on at once....

In any case... one would think a maintence hassle locomotive would be better then no locomotive. Those cars are not going to pull themselves.

And one would think that even IF CDOT spent the bucks for new GE whatevers. They wont be forthcomming anytime soon.

Another question. If for some reason Amtrak could be cajoled and/or persuaded to lease some of thier 700 series DMs. Would those work? Could the overunning retractable shoes be changed easily to underunning? And since these lack the "escape hatch" doors in the front, are they even allowed into GCT?

I trully wonder if CDOT even knows that MN is sitting on 6 or so locomotives. Perhaps MN is keeping quiet about them because they think CDOT will pony up for new ones if they think there are none available

Cdot was told about the FL9AC's but took no action. They could have made up two 10 car super express trains to free up 20 mu's, and still have two locomotives spare.

Amtrak engines could be used if they had a emergency hatch. The third rail issue can be solved real easy, Amtrak has done so in past when they had to divert to GCT.

But Amtrak is not going to lease engines they need themselves, so that option is not possible.

As allways informative responses Dutch. Thank you.