Teen Killed By Train

http://www.wgal.com/news/9667761/detail.html
It's a shame. I used to go watch trains at the crossing which is just outside of the Mount Joy station. From what it had said in the Lancaster Intelligencer Journal this morning, it sounded like some people were trying to blame Amtrak and the borough officials and the crossing, which is completely wrong to do. I can only imagine how horrible the engineer feels.

I believe that that grade crossing where the incident happened doesn't have any gates and flashers. Are both sides of the ROW straight there? I have a feeling that the crossing will be eliminated once the Keystone Corridor gets its upgrades and electric trains back.

The crossing in question is a pedestrian crossing. It used to be a vehicle crossing many years ago (before my time). The road is blocked off, with a pathway for people to walk across.

There is a crossing bell ona pole there, and a sign that says "do not cross when bell is ringing".

If this is closed, people will have to basically take a half mile detour by using a nearby road overpass. Of course, right now, the road is blocked by little more than a picket fence. So they will need 6 foot razor wire, or most people will probably just hop across it.

Between 40-50 years ago ...

My Mom taught me a simple lesson: Trains on tracks win fights with squirrels, deer, dogs, cats, birds, people, bicycles, cars and trucks.

It's a lesson we should hammer into every Kindergartener, and reinforce it all life long.

I fully believe I am accountable for my own actions when my person or vehicle encounters a railroad ROW. Unfortunately, too many personal injury lawyers don't see things that way.

If there is one lesson I can ask everyone here who is a parent, grandparent, uncle/aunt, or cousin to share with loved ones and friends, it's...

People and moving trains don't mix!

This has been your railroad.net public service announcement for the day.

Hi John,

Interesting points, but there is one that also needs to be considered.

A while back, a teenager was struck and killed by a Metrolink train, Southern California, in the town of San Dimas. After a thorough investigation by the San Dimas PD and Metrolink PD, they concluded, "Suicide by train". The teen was despondent and had tried suicide once before. This time he was successful. So we now have a traumatized engineman and conductor, some passengers, and of course the teen's family etc.

Suicide is a problem, period. There are many broad factors going into even the simplest case.

All the railroads, including Amtrak, can do is make access to ROW tough enough that the reasonable man or woman will be fully discouraged from accessing the property.

My thoughts.

John, I'm interested in your thoughts on this. I have been told on more than one occasion that railroads sometimes prefer not to erect a fence because when that fence is eventually breached, as it always is, and someone is hit, it shows that the railroad is negligent because "they" saw there was a problem and chose to solve it in an unsatisfactory manner, thereby making the railroad liable.

I can think of hundreds of places I've seen that could use some type of fence, but none exists.

Your thoughts?

Dave Becker

(1)After leaving Philadelphia 1 hour 15 minutes late, due to late-arriving
equipment from NY Penn Station, we hit this trespasser at about 2:30PM.
(AMTRAK's name for anyone hit by a train.)

(2)The police and coroner tied us up for just over 3 hours. They had
trouble finding the body, because it was reportedly catapulted (in two
pieces) a long way from the tracks. I estimate that we were moving
at least 70mph when we struck the trespasser.

(3)We reached Altoona in the dark, thus preventing a daylight view
of Horseshoe Curve and the rest of the former PRR main line to
Pittsburgh.

(4)I second all of the above postings about educating everyone NOT
TO TRESPASS ON ACTIVE TRACKS.

(5)The engineer was relieved immediately, per standard AMTRAK
practice, and a replacement was driven-in from Harrisburg. I feel
very sorry for him...as I do for the parents.

I notice the brief news account mentions that the deceased and his pals were skateboarding.

I live in an urban neighborhood where a number of teens have attempted a clumsy sidewalk skateboard trick with rush hour traffic hurtling past, only to meet their demise under the wheels of a passing bus or garbage truck.

Sounds like this may be the Amtrak version of the same sad (and unfortunately stupid) scenario.

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Hi All,

As a warning; I have spoken with many Metrolink and UP RR cops. We / they usually bring up the subject of Suicide by Train. These cops seem to agree that it is becoming more popular since the victim is killed so quickly that there is no pain or suffering involved. A really quick and efficient way to end it all. The cops get very upset when they even hear about such an incident since many of them have gotten reports back from their colleagues that have had to investigate these things and "pick up the pieces and place them in a canvas bag." Not for those with weak stomachs.

MODERATOR'S NOTE:

With some regret, I am going to move this thread to General Railroad Operations.

Suicide is a significant societal and structural problem in our society. The emotional angst that drives a person to contemplate killing themselves to escape a set of life problems is overwhelming and monstrous.

The issue of using a train as the "weapon" impacts far broader than Amtrak.

The issue of finding ways to prevent suicide is beyond the scope of our Forum.

John_Perkowski wrote: I fully believe I am accountable for my own actions when my person or vehicle encounters a railroad ROW. Unfortunately, too many personal injury lawyers don't see things that way.

We have been told by our counsel in our BLET meetings that the lawyers bringing suit against the RR and engineers are going after the black box to identify anything the engineers may have done in regards to the events leading to the incident. These items include speeding since the engineer started his run, did he stay at or below track speed which would have allowed the train to either arrive at the scene ahead of time or behind time given track speed and if he was not traveling at track speed then this can be cause for the incident. Was full service and dynamic braking used vs. EIE/CIE with full dynamic braking, lights, bell and whistle? Amazing that it can be turned back onto the engineer by these guys.

pennsy wrote:Hi All,

As a warning; I have spoken with many Metrolink and UP RR cops. We / they usually bring up the subject of Suicide by Train. These cops seem to agree that it is becoming more popular since the victim is killed so quickly that there is no pain or suffering involved. A really quick and efficient way to end it all. The cops get very upset when they even hear about such an incident since many of them have gotten reports back from their colleagues that have had to investigate these things and "pick up the pieces and place them in a canvas bag." Not for those with weak stomachs.

We always called that situation "buttering the ballast", due to the large amounts of bright yellow fat, inside the human body. Nothing worse, though, than assisting those collecting up bits and pieces. A suicide near Elizabeth comes to mind, where the train was delayed for hours, while the parts were collected. The head was though to be lost, for good, until a crewman found it wedged into the underside of the pilot, "looking" down at the ballast. Not a great day for that crewman, to be sure........

Happens all the time. I work with a lot of guys who have hit people comitting suicied (obviously I dont know if this is the case). The worst one I remember is when an engineer friend of mine ''killed'' three teens racing home from high school. We live in a small rural town and the local news paper somehow got his name and printed it with the article. Sometimes when out in public people would call him "murderer'' or a ''killer''. It was awful.

People really dont believe it takes trains a long time to stop. My gf didn't know, and I told her and she was iffy, then she saw how long it took an Amtrak train approaching a station to stop and believed me