Railroad Forums
Status of CMSL to Cape May?
- Discussion relating to the PRSL
Moderator: JJMDiMunno
by PRSL1972
What is the problem with the bridge. The riding public will not tolerate constant set backs for rail service. If this continues CMSL might just say bye bye to thet part of the operation, hate to see that.
For what I have been seeing the direction of NJT is going which isn't great it should be disbanded and revert back to public service and rail to DOT. This will ensure all high paid brain dead people are weeded out!!!
by Douglas John Bowen
Given our experience statewide, NJ-ARP would respectfully note that much of the public swallows setbacks in rail service (quantity and quality) all the time.
But it's our job to minimize such setbacks, of course. And for the Cape May Branch, we continue to accept the challenge. For now, we can assure everyone that no plan or vision is in place to walk away from passenger rail service between Cape May City and Cape May Court House -- either by us or by Cape May Seashore Lines. We'd know if there were.
But it's our job to minimize such setbacks, of course. And for the Cape May Branch, we continue to accept the challenge. For now, we can assure everyone that no plan or vision is in place to walk away from passenger rail service between Cape May City and Cape May Court House -- either by us or by Cape May Seashore Lines. We'd know if there were.
by prsl7668
railbird wrote:ok ,There's more to it then just the bridge being out. Could be other things that caused no trains on the rest of the line. Maybe tracks are too bad to run bewteen CMCH and Cold Springs, not enough employees, or not enough running equipement to run trains in two places at the same time. Doubt you'll see trains on the Cape May Line this year....
so what is the problem with the bridge into cape may?
by Douglas John Bowen
NJ-ARP will reiterate that in fact, to our best knowledge, the return of rail passenger service to the lower portion of the Cape May Branch pretty much is just a matter of repairing the Canal Bridge.
We're told (by New Jersey Transit) the matter now has narrowed to some electrical and/or computer programming work related to the bridge's operation -- a fairly inexpensive matter that landlord New Jersey Transit will cover. We do not know of any specific target completion time.
NJ-ARP can also vouch that track conditions in the area, while far from ideal, will not preclude service resumption. Cape May Seashore Lines informs us that equipment and crew availability are not a problem.
Though it's hard to criticize prsl7668's pessimism regarding activity in this area in 2006, we at NJ-ARP remain somewhat more optimistic.
We're told (by New Jersey Transit) the matter now has narrowed to some electrical and/or computer programming work related to the bridge's operation -- a fairly inexpensive matter that landlord New Jersey Transit will cover. We do not know of any specific target completion time.
NJ-ARP can also vouch that track conditions in the area, while far from ideal, will not preclude service resumption. Cape May Seashore Lines informs us that equipment and crew availability are not a problem.
Though it's hard to criticize prsl7668's pessimism regarding activity in this area in 2006, we at NJ-ARP remain somewhat more optimistic.
by Notch 8
prsl7668 wrote: Maybe tracks are too bad to run bewteen CMCH and Cold Springs, not enough employees, or not enough running equipement to run trains in two places at the same time.It is easy to criticize however, statements like these. To make claims of track or equipment conditions would infer some sort of technical track expertise or hands on involvement with the CMSL itself. Both of which most likely are not involved in this case. This is how nasty railroad buff rumors are started. (It is also why railroaders do not like buffs by the way). To make bold assumptions on a public forum without any basis than just looking in from the outside is nothing more than pompus and irresponsible.
Let's keep to facts found through research from credible sources and keep the unbased theories to ourselves.
Last edited by Notch 8 on Fri Aug 25, 2006 7:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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by Douglas John Bowen
From experience in past years, it appears that a significant percentage of rail passengers on the lower Cape May Branch travel between Cape May City and Cold Spring Village.
Put another way, Cape May Seashore Lines generates a substantial portion of its revenue from a fairly short-distance station pair.
Conversely, the railroad would draw relatively little revenue (and perhaps ridership!), but incur substantial per-mile costs, from running between Cold Spring Cape May Court House.
At NJ-ARP, we've always argued that the goal in this arena is the resumption of true rail passenger service, not just "tourist" operations. To that end, we take seriously the idea(l) that people actually park at Cold Spring Village to avoid driving into Cape May -- and take the train to Cape May itself. The ridership numbers, as advanced to NJ-ARP by CMSL, seem to bear this out.
Even if we go with the beliefs of our detractors and critics, however, the fact remains that "the rest" of the line, minus Cape May City, lacks the clout that Cape May City offers even from a "tourist" perspective.
From a larger perspective, as we try to grow service in and around Richland Village, the southern goal expressed in these parts is almost never Cold Spring Village -- it's Cape May City.
Put another way, Cape May Seashore Lines generates a substantial portion of its revenue from a fairly short-distance station pair.
Conversely, the railroad would draw relatively little revenue (and perhaps ridership!), but incur substantial per-mile costs, from running between Cold Spring Cape May Court House.
At NJ-ARP, we've always argued that the goal in this arena is the resumption of true rail passenger service, not just "tourist" operations. To that end, we take seriously the idea(l) that people actually park at Cold Spring Village to avoid driving into Cape May -- and take the train to Cape May itself. The ridership numbers, as advanced to NJ-ARP by CMSL, seem to bear this out.
Even if we go with the beliefs of our detractors and critics, however, the fact remains that "the rest" of the line, minus Cape May City, lacks the clout that Cape May City offers even from a "tourist" perspective.
From a larger perspective, as we try to grow service in and around Richland Village, the southern goal expressed in these parts is almost never Cold Spring Village -- it's Cape May City.
by rvrrhs
I visit Cape May once per summer, and in fact just returned Thursday from a 5-day trip there.
What I've always found disappointing is how infrequent the service is between Cape May City and Cold Spring...when the bridge is functioning. Three morning trips and three afternoon trips isn't quite enough to make it viable for me. Five trips would be more like it.
I have wanted to take CMSL from Cape May City to Cold Spring, but the scheduling doesn't work in conjunction with Cold Spring Village's hours of operation--you can't stay very late at CSV. if you take the train.
What I've always found disappointing is how infrequent the service is between Cape May City and Cold Spring...when the bridge is functioning. Three morning trips and three afternoon trips isn't quite enough to make it viable for me. Five trips would be more like it.
I have wanted to take CMSL from Cape May City to Cold Spring, but the scheduling doesn't work in conjunction with Cold Spring Village's hours of operation--you can't stay very late at CSV. if you take the train.
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by chuchubob
prr60 wrote:From the CMSL website:Presumably when the Canal Movable Bridge is back in operation.
Cape May Court House to Cape May CityI wonder when the start date will be announced?
SATURDAYS and SUNDAYS
Start date to be announced
through Sunday, September 3
MONDAYS through FRIDAYS
Start date to be announced
through Friday, September 1
by blockline4180
chuchubob wrote:prr60 wrote:From the CMSL website:Presumably when the Canal Movable Bridge is back in operation.
Cape May Court House to Cape May CityI wonder when the start date will be announced?
SATURDAYS and SUNDAYS
Start date to be announced
through Sunday, September 3
MONDAYS through FRIDAYS
Start date to be announced
through Friday, September 1
Which may not be until Christmas or the spring of 2007.!
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by CGRLCDR
Out of curiosity, does anyone know technically what is wrong with the Cape May Canal Bridge? It seems very strange to me that it could be out of service for so long!
I've seen pictures of the bridge, but never seen it in person. From the pictures it looks to be generally in pretty good shape, as opposed to the DB drawbridge that is rusting into oblivion. What are the issues with getting the Capee May bridge repaired and back in service?
If this has already been covered elsewhere, just point me to the links.
I've seen pictures of the bridge, but never seen it in person. From the pictures it looks to be generally in pretty good shape, as opposed to the DB drawbridge that is rusting into oblivion. What are the issues with getting the Capee May bridge repaired and back in service?
If this has already been covered elsewhere, just point me to the links.
by prr60
CGRLCDR wrote:Out of curiosity, does anyone know technically what is wrong with the Cape May Canal Bridge? It seems very strange to me that it could be out of service for so long!Since no one who actually knows will tell the story, you question is pretty difficult to answer. However, since this is a movable bridge, my bet is that the problem is associated with that aspect, not with the structure.
I've seen pictures of the bridge, but never seen it in person. From the pictures it looks to be generally in pretty good shape, as opposed to the DB drawbridge that is rusting into oblivion. What are the issues with getting the Capee May bridge repaired and back in service?
If this has already been covered elsewhere, just point me to the links.
The real problem may be more political, however. NJ Transit owns the bridge. If the repairs are anything more than token, I suspect NJT is in no big hurry to spend money to fix a bridge they do not even use. NJT has lots of items demanding funding, and a finite budget to fund those items. Fixing the canal bridge so the CMSL can run a Santa train on a couple of weekends probably does not move this project up the NJT priority list. If that is the case, then it will probably take a nudge from some Cape May City and County political types to the bridge fixed.
This is all just a guess on my part. The reality is I have not factual data at all.