New York State Railroad Map!

As an individual involved in preparation of the map, I'm glad to see such enthusiasm for the new NYS rail map. I appreciate the feedback I've found here. There are a couple of good points raised here which I can clarify.

Lines Shown:
The map does not show all abandoned lines, but is the best available within NYSDOT at the time of publication. Based on the posts here, I have checked the data on the map against Russ Nelson's web site (which is very impressive!). Excluding trolley lines, which are not intended to be on the map, there are approximately an equal number of lines on Russ' map not on the NYSDOT map as there are lines on the NYSDOT map not in Russ' map. Over time, I anticipate the abandoned line coverage will be expanded to include those missing lines.

Note that active light rail / transit lines are not intended to be shown (SIRT, NYC Subway, PATH, etc..)

Inset Maps:
The inset maps do not show any abandoned lines at this time. Inclusion of the abandoned lines in the published map was a last minute decision. Unfortunately, there were some minor technical difficulties with the abandoned lines in the inset maps and ultimately the map was published without them, for now. Again, I anticipate that this will be addressed over time.

Abandoned vs. Active
The map depicts lines as abandoned only if they have gone through the formal ICC / STB abandonment process, or for non-jurisdictional tracks like Seneca Depot, if they are no longer connected to the active rail system.

NJT vs MNCR on Southern Tier:
There are a number of equally valid ways to label the rail lines where track ownership, dispatching, maintenance, and operations are separated, such as the Southern Tier. For the map, it was decided to define the operating railroad as the entity who publishes the employee timetable for a given route, regardless of ROW or track ownership, maintenance responsibility, dispatching, etc... , all of which could (and does) vary from who publishes the ETT. Any of the other methods produced results which would have raised far more questions...

Ray

Your map is very impressive, Ray. I plan to use it to label which railroads are active. I don't have that information in my database yet. A database does not a map make. Every mapmaker decides what to include and what to leave out for the sake of the presentation.

I will cheerfully admit defeat in the big cities, when it comes to being comprehensive. For example Syracuse used to have all street-running raillroads, and then they were all elevated. Evidence of the street-running is now completely obliterated, as are most trolley lines that were only street-running. And in NYC I know that there are elevated lines that got removed, leaving no trace at all.

I keep coming across bits of pieces of the puzzle, and I hope to make good use of your map to add to my collection. Thanks!

A new 2008 version of the NY State rail map has been posted to:

https://www.nysdot.gov/portal/page/port ... ailmap.pdf

Ray

Ray- thanks for posting the updated map. The fact that abandoned lines are shown at all is impressive. By the time the map is ready to be updated, we should be able to indicate additional mileage on the DURR and the CMRR!

-otto-

Thanks for posting notice of the map here. Thanks for including bodies of water. Thanks again for including abandoned railroads. This is helpful for historians and people looking for disused railbeds to convert to trails. May I suggest a couple of improvements:
1) Some of the trackage you have marked as abandoned still has the tracks, e.g. the CMRR that Otto mentioned, or the UHRR beyond North Creek to Tahawus.
2) Some of the trackage you have marked in red is "Class 0" trackage, to coin a phrase. To wit (and to be witty): the speed limit on such trackage should be zero. E.g. this trackage:
http://flickr.com/photos/russnelson/514324711/
3) I'd be happy to mark up your map to add a few missing abandoned railroads. Just ask.
4) Some of the railbeds on the map have been repurposed as named raill-trails. See http://rutlandtrail.org/railtrails.cgi <--- that is intended to be a complete and maintained listing.
5) Some of the railbeds have been repurposed as snowmobile trails. Arguably a special case of rail-trails, but they often only appear on snowmobile trail maps.

Please don't interpret this as criticism, just suggestions that *I* consider to be improvements.

Russ,

We had a few significant changes from last years map that you noted.

First as you note, we added lakes to the main state map. Second, we added abandoned lines to the insets. Last, there are more abandoned lines included than in last years version (with much thanks to your data) We know there are more abandoned lines, but updating the abandoned lines is of lower priority at DOT than maintaining (and expanding) our data on active lines. We will continue to expand the coverage of abandoned lines as resources permit in forthcoming updates.

NYSDOT has provided the GIS data behind the map to the NYS Office of Parks, Recreation & Historical Preservation (NYSOPHRP) for use in developing additional trails.

I welcome the suggestions, and those that followed the first release of this map last year were very helpful. In response to your suggestions I offer the following:

(1) and (2): You are correct on both points. However, after much deliberation internally, NYSDOT decided to show the rail lines based on their status with the STB (ie active or abandoned) regardless of the presence (or absence) of track. For pure tourist operations on lines formally abandoned with the STB, only trackage actually in service is shown as active.

Therefore, lines that still have tracks (like those you note) can be shown as abandoned, and lines without tracks (like the M&NJ from the state line to Slate Hill +/-) are shown as active. (See my Feb 26, 2007 post on this subject.)

(3) NYSDOT has used your data (nyrr 1.6) as one resource in identifying the location of abandoned corridors. These lines are then confirmed on a series of vintage USGS maps from the NY Public Service Commission, and are finally added to our GIS data by tracing the ROW in the NYS high resolution orthoimagery at a scale of 1:2000.

(4) and (5) This map is the official map of railroads in the state by the NYS Department of Transportation and it is not intended to capture rail-trails. As previously noted, the GIS data behind the map is shared with NYSOPRHP for thier use with respect to trails.

Ray

Thanks for the clarification. I'm surprised that the railroad line in *front* of the State Fairgrounds is not listed by the STB, since the last time I was at the Fair, a train ran down those tracks. That was only 2.5 years ago.

It's sad to look at the inset for Rochester. Oh, how the mighty have fallen.

The line in front of the NYS fairgrounds is very much active. From Solvay Yard, the Finger Lakes goes southwest; the CSX Rochester Sub goes WNW; the Fairgrounds Sub goes NW. The fairground is located almost due north of Solvay Yard, right in the corner between CSX's Rochester Sub and Fairground Sub.

I also just realized that you can turn the various features in the map on and off with Acrobat Reader 8.1, so you can turn off the active lines, abandoned lines, annotation, etc....

Ray

Ray,
thanks for the updated map!
fabulous as always!

one more minor error that wasnt corrected.
that small bit of LV track heading north-east out of Sayre, PA.
thats a small part of the old LV auburn division, and that particular bit of trackage hasnt existed for 30 years..

this:



should be this:


thanks,
Scot

Scotty,

I went back and checked our source GIS data. It didn't get updated by NYSDOT because it is in the PennDOT's data we used for the rail lines outside NY!!!

Ray

pretty awesome.

The line in front of the Fairgrounds was originally the Syracuse&Oswego
then the DL&W (Oswego Div) later Conrail (Baldwinsville Secondary).
Good line to fan if you can catch the Raddison (Bud) switch job.

unless my adobe reader is hosed, beacon and newburgh have switched sides of the hudson in the pdf!!!

Is this map available in shapefile form?

NYSDOT has posted a 2010 edition of the New York State rail map to:

https://www.nysdot.gov/divisions/operat ... %20Map.pdf

Enjoy!!!

Ray