NEC by Commuter Rail alone

Hey all…

I was just wondering how much of the NEC could be traveled without using Amtrak. From looking at the site, starting with NJ I could see that you can take NJ Transit from New York to Trenton, then SEPTA from Trenton NJ to Wilmington, DE. Now it seems like there is only Amtrak service from DE until MARC is reached. So am I correct in assuming that there are gaps in commuter rail service down the NEC?

There is a gap between Perryville, MD and Newark, DE (about 33 miles). From there you can ride commuter lines along the NEC as far north as New London, CT. MBTA service starts at Providence.

Look in this month's Trains — there is an AWESOME map with all commuter agencies in the Bowash megaopolis, and the number of trains run and their destinations — it also shows the gaps where there is no commuter service.

As a side note, according to the article, NJT has surpassed the "volume leader" in sheer number of trains, the LIRR. However, that included the eighty or so trips a day the Princeton dinky does, and without that, LIRR is still on top.

Very interesting. I still assume that the LIRR has more passengers though?

In 2005:

• Boston, MA-Providence, RI: MBTA
  
  Providence, RI-New London, CT: you'll have to fill this gap with Amtrak
  
  New London, CT-New Haven, CT: Shore Line East (technically, you could ride New London-Stamford on some trips)
  
  New Haven, CT-New York, NY (Grand Central Terminal): MTA Metro-North Railroad
  hop across town to Penn Station by MTA New York City Subway

ALTERNATE: New Haven, CT-New Rochelle, NY: MTA Metro-North Railroad and then New Rochelle, NY-New York, NY (Penn Station) via Amtrak...

• New York Penn Station-Trenton, NJ: NJ Transit
  
  Trenton, NJ-Philadelphia, PA: SEPTA
  
  Philadelphia, PA-Newark, DE: SEPTA
  
  Newark, DE-Aberdeen, MD: you'll have to fill this gap with Amtrak (even though MARC runs as far east as Perryville, MD)
  
  Aberdeen, MD-Baltimore: MARC
  
  Baltimore-Washington, DC: MARC

Here's an excercise in timetablemanship (new word). If you left Boston on the 8:30 AM MBTA train to Providence, when would you arrive in Washington?

Even if you do take an Amtrak train (93/83) from Providence to Old Saybrook, for an SLE Train, there will be no departure until the PM Peak Period. You have to take the Acela Express (2159)!

Or else that's six hours of thumb turning, and you won't be able to make it to Washington before the next day.

Fred Rabin wrote:Here's an excercise in timetablemanship (new word). If you left Boston on the 8:30 AM MBTA train to Providence, when would you arrive in Washington?

I get about 8:25 PM, almost twelve hours after leaving Boston. What you guys get?

You can also go south of DC to Fredericksburg, VA (about halfway between DC and Richmond) on Virginia Railway Express (VRE). I'm almost definite there is commuter rail in the Boston area on MBTA north of Boston on Amtrak's Downeaster corridor, but I don't know which line that is or how far it goes without looking it up.

To my knowledge, the VRE, MARC, and Shore Line East only run on weekdays. (I know the first two only run weekdays.) In addition, the VRE and I think Shore Line East only or primarily run peak periods on weekdays. (The same is true with the MARC Camden Line between DC and Baltimore, but the MARC Penn Line - the line that operates on the NEC - does run in the middle of the day, particularly between DC and Baltimore.) In addition, the SEPTA R2 has limited service to Newark, DE on weekdays, only runs to Wilmington on Saturdays, and does not go to Wilmington (or Newark) on Sundays.

Fred Rabin wrote:Here's an exercise in timetablemanship (new word). If you left Boston on the 8:30 AM MBTA train to Providence, when would you arrive in Washington?

Here I thought it was an exercise in determining which of us is the biggest train schedule nerd!

I may look up the answer later when I get home, but obviously the key factor is the headways for each of the commuter rail services, especially in the middle of the day in the middle of the NEC. Assuming weekday ridership, key schedule factors include:

• NJT NEC Line: 30-40 minute midday headways between New York and Trenton
• SEPTA R7 (East) Line: 60 minute midday headways between Trenton and Philadelphia
• MARC Penn Line: 60 minute midday/early evening headways between Baltimore and Washington (last southbound train leaves Aberdeen, MD shortly after 3 PM in most current MARC Penn Line timetable; there are a handful of southbound, evening trains between Baltimore and Washington)

I'm not sure, but it's possible it may be easier to make that NEC commuter rail day trip going northbound rather than southbound. Regardless whether that's true or not, I have a feeling one direction is probably somewhat easier to do than the other direction.

If one wants to travel to DC via commuter rail, it's worth it to pay extra for Amtrak. MARC doesn't really exist east of Baltimore and SEPTA R2 to Newark and even Wilmington is sparse.

Yeah, that's a given. Nothing beats a one seat ride. But it was an interesting exercise to see if one can time a trip via commuter rail along the NEC.

It's possible, but one delay, and you're done.

Going southbound, the connections won't line up for Shore Line East service. And although Amtrak serves both Newark, DE and Aberdeen, MD, they don't have any trains that hit both, let alone the connecting service with Septa and Marc.

Schedules effective Oct 30…

• MBTA LV South Station 06:25, AR Providence 07:25
  Amtrak LV Providence 09:01, AR New Haven 10:41
  Metro-North LV New Haven 10:57, AR Grand Central 13:09
  (Subway Connection from Grand Central to Penn Station)
  NJ Transit LV New York Penn 14:07, AR Trenton 15:33
  SEPTA R7 LV Trenton 15:45, Arrive 30th Street Philadelphia 16:36
  SEPTA R2 LV 30th Street 17:15, AR Wilmington 17:54
  Amtrak LV Wilmington 18:10, AR Baltimore Penn Sta. 19:05
  MARC LV Baltimore Penn 19:25, AR Union Station 20:25

Going northbound lines up better, and you can travel further:

• VRE LV Fredericksburg 05:15, AR Union Station 06:43
  MARC LV Union Station 07:12, AR Baltimore Penn 08:00
  Amtrak LV Baltimore Penn 08:12, AR Wilmington 08:59
  SEPTA R2 LV Wilmington 09:17, AR 30th Street 10:08
  SEPTA R7 LV 30th Street 11:01, AR Trenton 11:53
  NJ Transit LV Trenton 12:00, AR NY Penn 13:27
  NYC Subway to Grand Central
  Metro-North LV Grand Central 14:33, AR New Haven 16:17
  Shore Line East LV New Haven 16:27, AR Old Saybrook 17:17
  Amtrak LV Old Saybrook 17:59, AR Providence 19:17
  MBTA LV Providence 20:18, AR Boston South Station 21:13
  MBTA T connection to North Station
  Downeaster LV Boston North Station 23:20, AR Portland, ME 01:50

I can't believe that the Downeaster has a late train like that M-F, but that's what the schedule says online. Bring a good book for the trip.

cpontani wrote:I can't believe that the Downeaster has a late train like that M-F, but that's what the schedule says online. Bring a good book for the trip.

It won't for long (see second post of the thread).

What about price, is doing this any cheaper?

Are there buses that fill the gaps?

It's a do-nothing Sunday afternoon, so I figured what the heck, I ran through various commuter agency websites to answer asyouare's first question.

Is it cheaper? A resounding NO! (Although if there were no Amtrak-only segments, it would be.)

Using cpontani's eastbound trip from Fredricksburg, I checked the fares on the various commuter carriers and Amtrak. (Although I only ran it from Fredricksburg up to Boston. Who really wants to go to Portland, ME at 2 a.m.? And as Chip points out, it won't be possible for long anyway.)

An Amtrak ticket Fredricksburg to Boston is $111 for a 9.5 hour ride on Train 86. Same fare but longer running times on 94 or 66.

Going the commuter route, the total fare is $137.05 for a 16 hour ride. But $75 of that is to Amtrak for the Baltimore-Wilmington and OldSaybrook-Providence legs, meaning a total of only $62.05 to the various commuter carriers -- for a lot more mileage. (And yes, that includes 2 bucks for the NYC subway )

Here's the breakdown:

VRE $8.80
MARC $7.00
AMTK $46.00
SEPTA $7.00
NJT $11.50
NYCSub $2.00
MN $14.00
SLE $5.75
AMTK $29.00
MBTA $6.00

If I'm still bored later maybe I'll throw some distances onto the spreadsheet and do a comparison by cost-per-mile.

So I tossed the mileages onto the spreadsheet last night, and here's the result. (Easier to present as an embedded graphic, since HTML formatting a table is a pain-in-the-butt.)



Interesting to note the variation in commuter carrier fares, from a low of 12¢ a mile on SEPTA to a high of 20¢ on NJTransit. (Obviously the NYC subway flat fare is meaningless on a per-mile basis. NYP-GCT happens to be just about a mile. But a hypothetical "per-mile fare" could reasonably range from 10 bucks for a very short trip between two stations just a few blocks apart, just to get out of the rain, to a mere nickel for a 38 mile journey from the north Bronx to Far Rockaway. But for our purposes here, one mile really doesn't affect the averages!)

The per-mile fare on Amtrak, of course, varies dramatically, based on both total distance travelled and where that distance is travelled. Notice the last two lines I threw in: the incremental Amtrak fare for Fredericksburg to Boston, as compared to DC-Boston, is just $3.00 - only a third of the VRE fare and a mere 6¢ per mile. But an Amtrak ticket for just Fredericksburg to DC will set you back $27, or triple the VRE fare. Notice also the difference between the MD-DE segment and the CT-RI segment on Amtrak.

But still, Amtrak fares are generally higher than commuter rail fares. If the two "missing links" had commuter service so we could avoid Amtrak, using the average commuter cost of 17¢ per mile, the entire 509 mile journey would cost $87.50 - significantly less than the journey as now possible with the 2 Amtrak segments, and somewhat less than an end-to-end Amtrak trip.

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