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  • Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  • This forum will be for issues that don't belong specifically to one NYC area transit agency, but several. For instance, intra-MTA proposals or MTA-wide issues, which may involve both Metro-North Railroad (MNRR) and the Long Island Railroad (LIRR). Other intra-agency examples: through running such as the now discontinued MNRR-NJT Meadowlands special. Topics which only concern one operating agency should remain in their respective forums.
It is currently Tue May 07, 2024 4:15 am

Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

This forum will be for issues that don't belong specifically to one NYC area transit agency, but several. For instance, intra-MTA proposals or MTA-wide issues, which may involve both Metro-North Railroad (MNRR) and the Long Island Railroad (LIRR). Other intra-agency examples: through running such as the now discontinued MNRR-NJT Meadowlands special. Topics which only concern one operating agency should remain in their respective forums.

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, nomis, FL9AC, Jeff Smith

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by Jeff Smith
 
To paraphrase the bearded chubby guy said to Luke in the first Starwars, "STAY ON TOPIC". The rest is interesting and has been split into a new topic in General Commuter.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by ThirdRail7
 
Jeff Smith wrote:To paraphrase the bearded chubby guy said to Luke in the first Starwars, "STAY ON TOPIC". The rest is interesting and has been split into a new topic in General Commuter.

Actually, it the bearded chubby guy was Forkins, known as Red 6. He never uttered the infamous "Stay on target" phrase. That was coined by Gold 5 to the Gold Leader as Darth Vader's strike force closed on them in the trench. I don't know why everyone linked that phrase to Red Six's picture!

I should probably get out more often.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by amtrakowitz
 
Red 6 = Jek Porkins rather than Forkins. Gold 5's character was called Davish "Pops" Krail; Gold Leader's name was Jon Vander.

Wonder how effective a "turbo-laser" would be for drilling the new tunnels under the Hudson...?

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by Backshophoss
 
For better or worse,the problem is finding a clear route to run the tunnels on the Manhatten side of the Hudson River,
under the PCB layer thru the maze of underground uitilties,subway tunnels,and sewers.
There may not be any way to bore the tunnel thru that maze without MAJOR relocation of underground uitilties,
and sewers.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by morris&essex4ever
 
Would building these tunnels matter a lot if NJ was a more business friendly state?

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by Backshophoss
 
Run that buy your Governor.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by amtrakowitz
 
morris&essex4ever wrote:Would building these tunnels matter a lot if NJ was a more business friendly state?
That has nothing to do with Amtrak. And the answer would still be yes, assuming a significant change in commuting patterns from NY into NJ.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by morris&essex4ever
 
Obviously if corporations and businesses were in NJ's cities, far fewer people in NJ would commute to/from NYC during the work week. And it is relevant to Amtrak as less demand into NYC could free up slots at NYP.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by amtrakowitz
 
But that also makes Hudson County (and other NJ counties presumably) a destination for Amtrak, LIRR and Metro-North east of Hudson service, potentially requiring the new tunnels anyhow. Amtrak currently does not stop in Hudson County, but potentially could by serving either Secaucus Junction or Hoboken Terminal (the latter being fodder for another thread).

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by Jeff Smith
 
The topic is Gateway Tunnels, not telecommuting or electric delivery vehicles.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by amtrakowitz
 
morris&essex4ever wrote:NYC in the 1980s was just as bad if not worse than Newark is today. IIRC, even the NYSE threatened to move to NJ if lower Manhattan wasn't "cleaned up." If NYC got it's act together, why can't we make cities in NJ better environments for businesses and reduce the need for people to commute to NYC? More jobs in NJ, more tax revenue for NJ, better for NJ's economy
Again, that does not reduce the need to commute through NYC, especially if commuters coming from the east, north and northeast have to cross the Hudson to get to work. It also puts an additional strain on Amtrak since the NJ stations it stops at do not have the same capacity platform-wise.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by ThirdRail7
 
I guess they are taking this proposal to the next level since the window of opportunity is narrowing. Apparently, LIRR has been approached about temporarily abandoning West Side Yard.

A brief "fair use" quote:

Amtrak tunnel project to uproot LIRR facility
http://newyork.newsday.com/news/new-yor ... -1.5129041
Amtrak's plan to build a new tunnel under the Hudson River into Penn Station will require the LIRR to move a critical train maintenance facility from Manhattan to Queens for more than two years, officials said.

Shifting maintenance operations from the Long Island Rail Road's West Side Yard to its Hillside, Queens, facility would put workers and resources farther away from any train breakdown in or near Penn Station for 26 months.

"If we had our druthers, would we be doing this? No," LIRR president Helena Williams said. "But we recognize that we're in a region where . . . intercity rail's future is extremely important, and we're cooperating."

Williams said the move is needed to accommodate Amtrak's Gateway Project, which includes new tunnels and tracks between Penn Station and Newark. One of those tunnels would run directly under the LIRR's maintenance facility on the yard's east side.

Although Gateway is not targeted for completion until 2040, construction on the tunnels needs to begin soon because Manhattan developer Related Companies plans to install structural supports in the same location for a commercial and residential project on top of the yard. The LIRR expects to make about $1 billion from a 99-year lease for the development.

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by Greg Moore
 
ThirdRail7 wrote:I guess they are taking this proposal to the next level since the window of opportunity is narrowing. Apparently, LIRR has been approached about temporarily abandoning West Side Yard.

A brief "fair use" quote:

Amtrak tunnel project to uproot LIRR facility
http://newyork.newsday.com/news/new-yor ... -1.5129041
Yeah, saw a note of that elsewhere. Is this related to the "box" I understand they're building the SW corner to make sure the space for the tunnels is reserved from future construction or other work?

Regardless, it's slowly one step forward.

Still can't believe we're talking 2040 for everything. We really need to figure out as a nation how to do such projects a lot faster. (Same thing with stuff like the SAS.)

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by Backshophoss
 
So in effect the 3rd tunnel is now aimed at connecting with the Empire connection tunnel,with that Jct winding up
under LIRR's West Side yard(a single switch),that would be the least disruptive to all involved.
Why deadhead equipment all the way back to Hillside,a simple crossover from 1 of the Sunnyside loop tracks to Yard A(ESA yard),and service
them at Arch Street(space permiting).

Re: Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

  by 25Hz
 
Backshophoss wrote:So in effect the 3rd tunnel is now aimed at connecting with the Empire connection tunnel,with that Jct winding up
under LIRR's West Side yard(a single switch),that would be the least disruptive to all involved.
Why deadhead equipment all the way back to Hillside,a simple crossover from 1 of the Sunnyside loop tracks to Yard A(ESA yard),and service
them at Arch Street(space permiting).
Two tunnels, connecting to the yard stub end tracks next to the empire tunnel bellmouth. Basically you'll see 3 tunnels, 2 go under the hudson one connects to points north.

And i agree, projects here in the US take WAY too long for no real reason.
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