by Tommy Meehan
Or she lacked situational awareness. Almost anything she could have done would've been better than what she did.
Railroad Forums
Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, nomis, FL9AC, Jeff Smith
EuroStar wrote:Also, remember that in an accident, the pantograph can tear off, or tear down energized wires. At 12,000 to 25,000 volts, that's no picnic, either. Apparently the car was pushed almost an entire train length up the line. Since there is no third rail in the crossing roadway, that means the SUV, being pushed sideways, would have encountered third rail end-on, which may explain why the rail was dislocated and pierced the car and the first MU.dnelson wrote:Two immediate questions come to mind: if this train was led by a typical locomotive or some sort of passenger-less spacer instead of MU cars with passengers sitting beginning directly behind the cab, would any passengers have died? If this train wasn't powered via third rail which ignited the fire, would any passengers have died? I'm not actively criticizing third rail powered MUs, but this is a horrifying number of deaths for what appears to be an otherwise typical grade crossing accident.There are multiple reasons why the leading cars have passengers: (1) you will need extra track length at Grand Central for that car (not necessarily platform, but track), (2) maintaining yet another type of car costs money (more than you think) and every timethey break and you do not have such a car as a spare you will need to cancel the train, (3) operating a non-revenue car (actually 2 of them on each end) costs money to move the dead weight back and forth (again a lot more than you think), (4) when people are crowding in the rest of the cars you will get political pressure to let them in these "spacer" cars to alleviate the crowding. The reality is that it is much cheaper and effective to grade-separate (but it is still tons of $$$ which nobody is willing to pay to get done) and then there is the NIMBY.
As for the third rail, we will need to wait for the results of the investigation. Catenary wire cannot pierce a car shell, but the standard 25kV can cause sparks and fires too if the right conditions occur. The reasons why catenary is practically exclusive in new construction are cost (most important) and height (it is out of reach of pedestrians).
keyboardkat wrote:If she tried to wave at the train to stop, then this is just ignorance. There needs to be some education of the public, perhaps in the media, definitely in driver education classes, about trains, stressing one simple fact: A train, consisting of a number of cars each weighing perhaps 60 or 70 tons, and possibly a locomotive which may weigh as much as 140-150 tons, simply CANNOT be stopped on a dime! By the time the engineer sees you and realizes you're not going to get out of the way, it's already too late. It takes considerable distance to stop a train, or even to slow it down. You NEVER, EVER try to beat a train across a road crossing. That's always going to be a losing game.When I was in 5th grade, we had a series of safety lectures at my elementary school. The CL&P folks showed us a rather terrifying series of slides of what happens when you touch wires; the man from the railroad (have no clue if it was Conrail or MNRR) showed us a film of a car running over an empty coke can and told us that the weight difference between a can and a car was the same as the difference between a car and a train. Both stick with me still, 30+ years later. If they don't still do this in schools, they should.
nomis wrote:There is an NTSB briefing set to start any minute now - live feed @ http://7online.com/live/Nomis and Everyone:
UPDATE: Service Plan for the Harlem Line for the Remainder of Wed., Feb. 4th
Metro-North Harlem Line train service on Wednesday, February 4 will remain suspended between Pleasantville and North White Plains until further notice due to the train/car collision near Valhalla. There will be limited bus/train service for Upper Harlem Line customers until further notice.
See the Train/Bus Schedule.
Please Note:
-Customers are strongly encouraged to work from home if possible or should seek alternate service
-Harlem Line tickets will be cross honored on the Hudson and New Haven Lines
-Free parking will be available at Cortlandt Station on the Hudson Line
-Westchester County parking available on a first-come, first-served basis:
Up to 300 spaces at the County Center near White Plains Station
Up to 50 spaces at the North White Plains Station
-Customers should expect crowded conditions and delays
-Listen for announcements at your station
Off Peak & PM Peak Southbound Service
Train service is available from Southeast and Wassaic to Pleasantville.
A shuttle bus service will operate between Pleasantville and North White Plains.
From North White Plains, there will be train service to all points south.
There will not be service at Hawthorne and Valhalla Stations. Customers should go to an alternate station.
Northbound Service
There will be train service to North White Plains Station with bus service to Pleasantville; train service will continue northbound to Southeast with connections to Wassaic.
The train cars cannot be removed until the on-scene investigation is complete, and they will need to be removed before service can be restored. Regular service through this area is not expected to resume until a full investigation is complete, the infrastructure is fully assessed, and repairs are made.
As more information becomes available we will notify you as soon as possible. Please continue to visit this website for updates and listen for announcements at your station.
Rockingham Racer wrote:Can anyone here tell us whether or not the traffic signals are interlocked with the railroad?Yes it is.
JimBoylan wrote:TAN Chatsworth, Calif. reactionThe incident on Metrolink being referred to was the 2005 Glendale Crash where a train with the cab car leading struck a Jeep on the tracks and caused a chain reaction crash with two other trains.
The Metrolink train at Chatsworth in 2008 had a Diesel locomotive leading. After the crash, it was found telescoped inside the 1st passenger car that it had been pulling.
There have been fires after Diesel train accidents that were not at grade crossings, or in 3rd rail territory.
nomis wrote:hird rail public grade crossings happen, off the top of my head, only on a couple systems here: MN, LIRR, Chicago CTA.No grade crossings on the ex-Philadelphia & Western trackage operated by SEPTA?