Saratoga & North Creek (S&NC) Discussion

CP. never pulled anything out. I believe only one rail length was taken out, which was above Corinth. The rumor was because UHRR did not have to follow all federal rules, if they weren't connected to the national network. CP did make a special move up the branch, after the mill closed. UHRR acquired a coach from Ontario Northland. This car sat in Saratoga engine terminal, until the special move was made.

Even when SNC started, there was a manual derail, which was up at the property line, between what remained D&H, and what was sold to the town. That was removed, and a split rail power derail is now part of the control point CPC38 (AD Cabin).

Here are some items Justin discussed at the Warren County Public Works Committee meeting on 7-25-17.

1. The 2018 operations plan is just about ready and hopefully will be completed by the end of August.
2. They are looking to move the Polar Express from the Saratoga Station. The reason for the move is CP Rail only allows for two trips a day and S&NC would like to increase the number of daily trips. The new location would be on track that S&NC controls.
3. They are working on two freight contracts, one for outgoing freight and one for incoming deliveries. The outgoing one is to move 40,000 tons of sand down state for use in construction in 2018. The incoming is for one carload a month.
4. The rail bike group started the weekend after the 4th and is doing very well. They've had very few seats available. They want to ramp up to 3-4 trips a day, 7 days a week.
5. There is a job opening for a chef.

That's all. Sounds positive to me, but I'm a glass half full guy.
Don

Just a quick cross-post to the IP forum... nothing to see here leaving in NYS Railfan

I have heard that there is a rail-bike tour from North Creek northward. But I looked on the Rail Explorers website and saw nothing about it there. They were the ones who operated between Saranac Lake and Tupper Lake last year. Does anyone know who is operating these rail bikes on the S&NC, or anything wlse about it?

https://www.revrail.com

It's a new company. Founded by a couple former employees of Rail Explorers.

I railfanned at the Saratoga station last Friday (8/11). The 10AM S&NC
trip did not run. The loco 4135, one coach and one dome car were
shut down and parked on station track #2. No personnel were seen
and the office inside the station was locked. Apparently, they are not
running four days a week at this time. No posted schedule was in sight.

Dick H wrote:...Apparently, they are not
running four days a week at this time. No posted schedule was in sight.

I went to their website and it at first looks like you can buy tickets for Thurs/Fri/Sat/Sun, but if you click on any of the Thurs/Fri options (at least all the ones I tried), it doesn't let you buy a ticket. So it seems Sat/Sun only right now.
JS

With the new rail bike starting this week out of North Creek.. Is there any coordination with the trains out of Saratoga Springs? I see nothing on either of their websites.

FYI - these bikes are SOLD-OUT through November, Probably more people on a bike than a trail?

interesting piece today on the trials and tribulations of the SNC.

http://poststar.com/news/local/landlord ... af25d.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Supervisors have questioned the company's tourist train schedule in recent years, saying that its basic 6-hour trips from Saratoga Springs to North Creek and back appeal only to die-hard train riders.

This railroad is not the only one with their head in the sand. Railroad operators far too often seem unable to grasp this basic fact.

To be fair, part of the original appeal of the ride was the layover at North Creek to shop the local boutiques, have lunch at local restaurants, and so on. It was marketed as a day trip from Saratoga Springs. I think SNC was expecting more support from North Creek, or expecting more attractions to pop up, but they never did. Otherwise, a six-hour train trip is a non-starter for most casual tourists.

-otto-

Trouble ahead: PostStar.com

Landlord shuts railroad out of building over unpaid rent

JOHNSBURG — The owner of a storage building next to the North Creek rail station said he has locked Saratoga & North Creek Railway out of the building because of $25,000 in unpaid rent.

The large building, located at 320 Main St., to the left of the driveway into the rail depot, was being used by the railroad for storage, including that of equipment for the annual Polar Express holiday trips, a backhoe and other equipment, according to property owner John McAlonen.

McAlonen said the company was behind on its rent into last year, and its last check, for $1,000, bounced. In all, he said, $25,000 is owed.
...
The railway is also behind on its payments to Warren County, owing about $4,200 from last year, and has not filed monthly ridership reports this summer, according to the Warren County Treasurer’s Office. The company guarantees $81,000 in revenue each year.
...

There has been another ex NJT, or MNCR engine at Saratoga D&H yard. There is also a full length dome, and ex LIRR double decker. Someone told me that D&H/CPR is not interchanging it because fees, such as trackage rights, and rental, which is for the platform tracks is in arrears.

The business plan for S&NC seems like a non starter to me. As others have said, it is a long trip to NC. The old Upper Hudson ride was short enough to not bore everyone except a buff. The novelty of the ride fades fast. There are only so many things to do up and there.

The schedule of the Amtrak trains is not conducive to connecting for ski trains. The drive from Saratoga is only 45 minutes-1 hour. The train would take too long. Many Gore customers come from other places, where Saratoga is not on the way. This means that S&NC can only tap into a fraction of Gore's customer base.

The Polar Express is another looser. The price is very high, and is is only maybe a 10 mile round trip to Kings. Of course the kids' attention spans aren't too long at that age. The royalties to the movie company must be very high. If they just called it something else, like the Santa Express, then that expense would be eliminated.

The freight business is another non starter. There is only an infinite amount of tailings in Sanford Lake. The only hope for any freight would be a war, or other emergency, where titanium mining would commence again. Who knows if Corinth will be able to redevelop the old IP mill site. The only other hope might be lumber, or logs for the other paper mills, like Finch and Pruyn, or IP Mill 10. Here trucks are much more convenient. I see tons of log trucks, where Route 22 parallels the D&H main.

I just feel sorry for the tax payers. The government bought a line with little commercial potential. Like I said, Corinth wants to develop the old mill. Any fly by night with a switch engine could handle that.

S&NC proposes to store rail cars north of North Creek.
http://poststar.com/news/local/railroad ... 3f984.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;