The East Side Access Project Discussion (ESA)

Funding news: http://www.progressiverailroading.com/p ... p?id=27039

The East Side Access project calls for creating a rail link from MTA Long Island Rail Road via the 63rd Street Tunnel to Grand Central Terminal in New York City. The project would save commuters up to 40 minutes in travel time to Manhattan’s east side and free up much-needed capacity at Penn Station, but “is on trajectory to run out of funding at the end of 2011” because the remaining $2.2 billion to finish the project has yet to be secured, Schumer said.

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Amtrak7 wrote:According to the LIRR committee meeting video, they are "burying" the Manhattan TBM at 37th St by turning it left when its done and not removing it.

That seems very stupid. Aren't these things pretty big and expensive? Is there seriously no way they'd be able to sell the machine to someone else after they're finished? Why do I have a feeling that someday, be it 5 years, 15 years or 25 years from now, there will be some other project dreamed up, where they'll wind up regretting the fact that this gigantic TBM was just left behind, right in the way of whatever it is they need to build.

Burying a TBM is standard procedure. To disassemble it would cost far more than anyone's going to pay for a secondhand TBM - my personal guess would be that dis-assembly costs more than a new one. Especially since it's in the middle of the tunnel, so you can't just drive it out and take it apart on Fifth Avenue.

I also suspect that, unmaintained, a TBM may rust very quickly.

Since the Contractor bought the TBMs, he gets to decide what to do with them. Since they were modified to fit through completed tunnel for repeated drives, taking them out is not a problem. Resale on rock TBMs is high and usually worth retrieving the machines. So, it is no surprise that the TBMs will be removed.

removed ???
thought they were buried ??

The EGE wrote:Burying a TBM is standard procedure. To disassemble it would cost far more than anyone's going to pay for a secondhand TBM - my personal guess would be that dis-assembly costs more than a new one.

jlr3266 wrote:Since they were modified to fit through completed tunnel for repeated drives, taking them out is not a problem. Resale on rock TBMs is high and usually worth retrieving the machines.

We seem to have two diametrically opposed statements here. Anyone know which is correct?

Best of both worlds. The Robbins TBM has a bolted cutterhead, so it will be removed and reused. The Seli machine has a welded cutterhead and will to the side of it's final run, stripped of its guts, and abandoned. That is the plan this week, but everything can change.

This week the Robbins machine is on it's way through the tunnels to Queens for retrieval and the Seli machine has been stripped and ready for fill.

Deep Below Park Avenue, a Monster at Rest

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/25/nyreg ... f=nyregion

"Rome has the catacombs; Paris has its sewers. Now New York will have its own subterranean wonder: a 200-ton mechanical serpent’s head.

It is a gargantuan drill that has been hollowing out tunnels for a train station under Grand Central Terminal. As tall as four men and with the weight of two whales, the so-called cutter head — the spinning, sharp-edged business end of a tunnel boring machine — is usually extracted, dismantled and sold for scrap when the work is done".

I think the Manhattan crew even had a funeral.

I figured I'd share this with you this morning... it boggles my mind. I know there's a format to posting links/articles, and I apologize for being remiss, I'm just going to post the URL and the line that peeved me so. Article: http://gizmodo.com/5825349/this-200+ton-earth-worm-is

"Right now, there's a 22-foot-wide metal monster dying 14 stories below park avenue. Together with its twin brother, it excavated 346,607 cubic yards (265,000 cubic meters) of bedrock in a 30,000-foot-long (5.6 miles) tunnel.

Now the engineers behind the East Side Access Project-a tunnel that connects New York's Grand Central Terminal to another terminal in Queens—have decided to let the machine die, abandoned to rot after excavating its own tomb under Manhattan. But why leave it there?"

A tunnel that connects New York's Grand Central Terminal to another terminal in Queens? Hah... so I guess the LIRR no longer serves Long Island. ESA is all just for a shuttle to Jamaica TERMINAL. Guys, "change at Jamaica" is now "terminate at Jamaica." I'd criticize on the website as well, but I've already had critical comments deleted by that author.

darthdoosh wrote:"...Now the engineers behind the East Side Access Project-a tunnel that connects New York's Grand Central Terminal to another terminal in Queens—have decided to let the machine die, abandoned to rot after excavating its own tomb under Manhattan. But why leave it there?"...

...A tunnel that connects New York's Grand Central Terminal to another terminal in Queens? Hah... so I guess the LIRR no longer serves Long Island. ESA is all just for a shuttle to Jamaica TERMINAL. Guys, "change at Jamaica" is now "terminate at Jamaica." I'd criticize on the website as well, but I've already had critical comments deleted by that author..."

Cost $9M more than scrap return = business decision. What did I miss? And, yes the article did make it sound like a terminal to terminal project, not a major gateway to LIRR. Another rail article written without verification by a "reporter". Darth consider the fact it is on a blog and review the comments that follow: infantile, shallow, or just stupid without adding any real input pro/con or to the thread.

Here's my input: http://www.mta.info/capconstr/esas/
MTA Long Island Rail Road’s Connection to Grand Central Terminal

http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirr/licity/licity2.htm My webpage ESA 2003-2007

Does anyone know the final decision as to where a Sunnyside station would be, and what transfers would be possible there? IE Penn vs. GCT vs. #7 vs HPA?

The Final decision of where Sunnyside Station goes happened back in 2000 in the EIS stage. It would (if built) be located near subways (kind of) under the Thomson Ave Bridge area. Past the connection to GCT, so only useful for NYP trains. Amtrak will not be stopping there, if it is ever built.

FYI the second soft ground tunnel boring machine has launched and should be penetrating the launch wall before the end of the week.