Montauk line needs longer trains

I took the 2:51 Montauk/Jamaica run today and it was standing room only from Speonk west. I've never seen an LIRR diesel this packed.

It would be hard for riders today to believe that just twenty years ago, Friday night Montauk trains often ran with sixteen cars, or second sections, or that the Cannonball was a twelve-car all-reserved-seat parlor car train.

The Railroad willingly gave it all up to the bus companies in recent years.

The summer still draws a lot of demand for the rails. It's a shame the railroad doesn't take advantage of this and add more trains (and I hate the 'there isn't enough equipment' excuse....buy more equipment!) Some trains don't get really really busy until Bayshore....but, the demand still warrants more service. I saw a train stop at Bayshore once a couple years ago (and I'm sure most of them are like this) where the platform was PACKED with people, and it was a 5 or 6 car push-pull train, and on the east end, the line started at the east door of the furthest east passenger car, and extended east on the platform beyond the nose of the engine. If the railroad continues to allow this service to go on, it's really pathetic and is a huge missed opportunity.

sorry but you're not part of our 'core' market

shortage of equipment

insert excuse ________________

Port Jervis wrote:I took the 2:51 Montauk/Jamaica run today and it was standing room only from Speonk west. I've never seen an LIRR diesel this packed.

There are a number of factors going on here, including gass prices (yes, even The Hamptons people are economizing), and a recent fare increase on both
The Hampton Jitney, and Hampton Luxury Liner. As an example, the "base" South Fork HJ fare is now $30.00 o/w, versus $15.25 off peak LIRR, which the train you mentioned is. Granted most HJ riders use the 12 trip ValuePacks, which cut the cost drasticlly, but this time of the year, with tourist traffic up, the casual riders don't ask about these multi-ride tickets.

As an example, I saw this train last Friday (6/27), as it approached East Hampton, and there were a good 60 peole waiting for it, and this was a FRIDAY going TO the city. This past Monday, a neighbor of mine drove to Westhampton to catch the Monday extra train (needless to say we have no such Monday morning
extra on the North Fork) and had to stand all the way to Jamaica.

Yes, there is shortage of diesel equipment, and this Summer will be interesting to say the least.

Keep your fingers crossed about this THURSDAY, as it is a pre-Holiday, with all the Summer Extras running, INCLUDING, yes, amazing as it is, The extra run to Greenport, although I will bet that when like LIRR lists the extras running on it's website it will "forget" to list the Greenport extra (God forbid, it might actually draw a crowd, and show there is demand).

Ken

There are a number of factors going on here, including gass prices (yes, even The Hamptons people are economizing), and a recent fare increase on both
The Hampton Jitney, and Hampton Luxury Liner.

This is both attributable to rising gas prices. If the bus companies didn't call it a fuel surcharge, that means they just don't have any intent on adjusting it in the future. So if by some miracle gas prices drop, they don't have to remove the surcharge.

The extra run to Greenport, although I will bet that when like LIRR lists the extras running on it's website it will "forget" to list the Greenport extra (God forbid, it might actually draw a crowd, and show there is demand).

Technically, in railroad terms, it is not an extra train, since it does have a spot in the timetable. An extra train is a train that does not have timetable authority.

Jay

RPM2Night wrote:The summer still draws a lot of demand for the rails. It's a shame the railroad doesn't take advantage of this and add more trains (and I hate the 'there isn't enough equipment' excuse....buy more equipment!) Some trains don't get really really busy until Bayshore....but, the demand still warrants more service. I saw a train stop at Bayshore once a couple years ago (and I'm sure most of them are like this) where the platform was PACKED with people, and it was a 5 or 6 car push-pull train, and on the east end, the line started at the east door of the furthest east passenger car, and extended east on the platform beyond the nose of the engine. If the railroad continues to allow this service to go on, it's really pathetic and is a huge missed opportunity.

All this train needed was one additional bi-level (it had 4). If equipment is a problem, then they should consolidate the 11:12 from Jamaica to Montauk with that Babylon-Speonk local which runs 30 minutes in front of it. On a three hour trip, stopping at Oakdale, Great River, Islip and Bellport isn't a big deal. The 2:51 on the way back does anyway.

de402 wrote:sorry but you're not part of our 'core' market

shortage of equipment

insert excuse ________________

Stop using 4-car consists on the off-peak Oyster Bay/Jamaica shuttles! This was not a peak train, so there's gotta be equipment sitting around somewhere.

The Oyster Bay branch has been using 3 car trains for a lil while. But, then again, lately, they've been sending 8 car double ended trains out there too...so it kinda negates the whole sending 3 cars out thingie anyway.

Would it be possible to design a DMU version of the M-7 for east end shuttle services? Give up some seating between door and engineer cab to relocate under carrage eqiupment to make room for diesels and other necessary equipment? Maybe install 3rd rail at the stations to give supplemental power while engine is entering/exiting and stopped at station?

RPM2Night wrote:The Oyster Bay branch has been using 3 car trains for a lil while. But, then again, lately, they've been sending 8 car double ended trains out there too...so it kinda negates the whole sending 3 cars out thingie anyway.

I only see those on the two Penn Station runs. I rode a 5 car train a couple of weeks ago (4:54 LIC/OB via lower Montauk) and it was fairly empty the whole way.

I'm sure they can scrounge up one C-3 to assure a 5-car consist is used on the 11:12 JAM/MTK and the return 2:51 MTK/JAM, at least until Labor Day.

Just as another example.

We have an intern in my office who works on Tue/Thur for the summer, riding out on the morning train and back on the mid-aftenoon Montauk trains.

Today (Tuesday) he said that after the change to a diesel in Babylon (4 cars), it was standing room only until Speonk.

Clearly ridership is much higher this season.

Ken

This topic is leading me into asking why did the LIRR severely short hand their diesel fleet? regardless of the crap of power they chose what was the excuse they used to not buy enough bi-level cars? an even 200 coaches including the cab cars would have been suffice.

workextra wrote:This topic is leading me into asking why did the LIRR severely short hand their diesel fleet? regardless of the crap of power they chose what was the excuse they used to not buy enough bi-level cars? an even 200 coaches including the cab cars would have been suffice.

i just don't think 'management' knows what they're doing... then again what do i know...

--armchair dispatcher

de402 wrote:i just don't think 'management' knows what they're doing... then again what do i know...

These days you just don't have many people coming up through the ranks like you used to. A majority of the folks callin the shots have never been on a train. A percentage of those have probably never even seen a train.