W Trenton project

Guest,

This is not about a possible cutback of the RVL, rather the possible start up of trains on CSX's Trenton line, re-establishing a service that existed about 20 years ago. Also, NJT was thinking of terminateing these possible future trains at Bound Brook, and not extending the service further east because of capacity issues.

>>>There is a connection at Bound Brook, though that is a very low speed <<<

That's not what would be used. The former Reading connection west of Bound Brook next to the solid waste transfer facility and along the PSE&G electric transmission line ROW would be restored. That was a high speed (relatively) connection.

To the extent that there are capacity problems, NJT a Trenton train would replace the train that starts out at Plainfield, and a probably a couple of trains that start at Raritan. They would only miss Raritan and Somerville, as Bridgewater is east of the old Reading connection. Not a big deal.

I was going to mention that as a possibility as well, though I wasn't sure if it would be phesable as I havent been in that area in awhile, only been over to Bound Brook recently, first time in about 6 months.

And as for capacity problems. then perhaps NJT should not have built high platforms where there used to be local tracks on the CNJ main, but instead have put tracks back there again...?

I don't believe that the capacity issues are on the ex-CNJ (though I heartily agree that leaving room for a third track at Westfield and Plainfield would have been more farsighted) but rather with freight on the Lehigh Line and moreso, from Hunter connection onto the NEC. Even the present trains often have to wait a few minutes at Hunter for the NEC to clear.

---Ken

"Again, hopefully it'll be 5 or 6 car trains rather then 2 or 3."

Oooh, ooh, I know this one. It's NJTRailfan. You had me fooled, not mentioning a GP40, but... I know that 5-6 car thing anywhere. At any rate, you probably want to get a username.

LOL, Ryanov. I guessed as much based on the typos.

There is an article in the Hunterdon section on a 900+ unit development proposed for the Bloomsbury/Bethlehem County border, which should make people realize that extended RVL service is inevitable.

Guest wrote:

When NJT wants to terminate service in Bound Brook does this mean they want to elimiante stops further west?

To clarify for the uninitiated, what this means is that NJT would run trains between W. Trenton and Bound Brook, where riders would have to change to the Raritan Valley Line trains to go further east.

The Raritan Valley trains would still run west beyond Bound Brook. The West Trenton trains would not run on any other train's lines.

Sorry guys, That guest wasn't me. But here I am.

So if passengers have to change more then twice that isn't good at all. Then it wouldn't even be anythign like the NEC where you make a transfer once. Anymore then that is not good. 1st a passenger goign to Hoboken or NYP has to change off the Septa in W Trenton. Then the process is repeated in Boundbrook and then again in Newark if that passenger wants to go to NYP or somepalce offthe Path system.

That transfer in Boundbrook isn't nessesary. Bad enough you've gotta transfer twice but 3 times? Coem on. It's bad enough passengers have to transfer on the Boonton and NJCL from an electrified to diesel or reverse. That one transfer is bad where NJT wil lfianlly fully electrify and now NJT wants to punish potential passengers with 3 transfers?

NJT had better rethink that stratagy if they want this thing to be as successful as MOM and not end up like the ACL.

Another project which would generate ridership is re-establishing passenger service to Flemington.

As far as Bloomsbury goes, yes the proposed housing development is on the docket but neither Bloomsbury nor Bethlehem Twp. has given approval. Bethlehem Twp. has been very willing to spend large amounts of money to prevent housing developments. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Bethlehem Twp. and Bloomsbury were to push for a park and ride and reactivation. It would prevent a substantial amount of land from being used as a housing development.

Service between Newark and PHL via West Trenton consisted of two trains of RDCs each way, two NB in the morning and two SB at night. These were cut in 1982 as part of a general cutback by NJT shortly after its formation. Other casualties included:

- Phillipsburg service via CNJ (cut back to High Bridge)
- Service to Atlantic City, Cape May, and Ocean City from Lindenwold

Conrail didn't single-track the New York Branch until the early 1990s. I presume the diamonds and double-track connection at Bound Brook were removed at the same time. Connection now is to the Lehigh Line, with a connection to the former CNJ east of Bound Brook station.

The original connection was *not* 15 MPH. We blew through there at about 40 on the "Crusader" in 1979.

Atleast that RDC service was direct. With what NJT is proposing you'd have to change two addtional tiems on top of the connection from Septa to NJT at W Trenton. That I can understand and possible the one at Newark Penn but to do it again at Boundbrook makes no sense. Either NJT work out another way or focus on some other project like MOM, H tunnels. Atleast MOM woun't be like that and the MOM trains would atleast go to Hoboken and you wouldn't have to transfer from MOM to NEC and then again at Newark Penn.

With the RVL extention it looks like if that is dead. I don't see it on their "to do" list. Thats sad because I was hoping for a rextenion to Bloomsbury. NJT really dropped the ball on this back in the 80s when they cut back on the RVL. They shouldn't have cut the route back that far but terminate it up to Hampton or Bloomsbury.

If service was going to go further according to NJT passenger service would terminate in Alpha rather then Philipsburg due to the are being run down and next to no space for parking plus it'll really be expensive to make the old station ADA compliant since it's below street level.

I think staggering through service with SEPTA would be the way to go with service. Have NJT and SEPTA run every other train from 30th Street to Newark and revive the old Crusader and compete with Amtrak. Either put 2 remanufactured RDCs mated with 2 Silverliners/Arrows and run WT to Newark by RDC and WT to Philly by MU, or complete diesel straight to 30th street (diesel can run through the tunnel as long as they don't stop at Market East or Suburban).

Thats a much better idea. Anything is better then making 3 transfers just to get to work/school which will only add unecessary time on the trip.

I concur that it is imperative to keep transfers to a minimum. Reopening the W.Trenton line would be great, but the fact is that people along the line have a number of other options for reaching Newark/NYC on NJT, including the RVL and the NEC. If the line is going to be successful, it'll have to provide people with a demonstrable advantage over driving to one of those stations (although not having to wait 4 years for parking might be advantage enough!), and making them transfer 3 times on the way to New York might frustrate that goal. The Packet article I posted earlier said the following regarding times:

"According to NJ Transit estimates, the driving and train travel times from Hillsborough to Newark on each of the lines would be: Hillsborough, 63 minutes; Somerville, 70 minutes, and Jersey Avenue, 80 minutes. To New York the estimated times are 89, 96 and 100 minutes, including transfer and wait times."

Assuming those times are w/out a Bound Brook transfer, how much time would a transfer likely add to the travel time?

Maybe they could revive the interurban and just make it a Ewing-Bound Brook light rail. Central Jersey LR ("subdivisionLINE"), anyone? Just kidding!