Amtrak Downeaster Discussion Thread

Saturday 4/13 PAR strikes again. #692 to be two hours late.
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One of NNEPRA's Strategic Goals & Initiatives is to relocate the Portland Train Station from its current location on the Mountain Branch (Portland Transportation Center) to the Mainline. Additional details at http://www.trainridersne.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Where would this new Portland station be? If the County Jail was relocated, that might work, but there is only 1500 feet between the Branch junction and Congress Street - I would think that more would be needed to put all the pieces in place for a multiplatform mainline station - especially one where one or both platforms was not blocking the main - while preserving the option for a Mountain platform in the future. (Oh, also there would be the small question of the jail relocation $ would come from!)

Maine Medical Center would probably like it since it would move the station closer to them. If both the jail property and the parking on the east side could be acquired, suddenly you've got potential for some property development.

On a more urgent note than a new Portland station, PAR needs to give consideration to not scheduling
it's through freights between Portland and Plaistow between 5AM and 10AM and 5PM and 10PM, as their
poorly maintained locos and cars are causing lengthy delays for the Downesasters several times a week.
Today, Saturday 4/13
#692 (Sold Out) 3 hours,17 minutes late into Boston, one hour after the Sox game started.
#693 2 hours, 40 minutes, late into Portland.
#696 2 hours, 23 minutes, late into Boston.

TRNE wrote:One of NNEPRA's Strategic Goals & Initiatives is to relocate the Portland Train Station from its current location on the Mountain Branch (Portland Transportation Center) to the Mainline. Additional details at http://www.trainridersne.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That's interesting, because the whole Thompson's Point project is set up as Transit-Oriented Development with a TIF to match, and the rail connection was a key part of that. They were also going to build a parking garage which the PTC would share.
It's also interesting to see that the wye is no longer in the cards, which explains why MDOT appears ready to sell that land to the city.

markhb wrote:

TRNE wrote:One of NNEPRA's Strategic Goals & Initiatives is to relocate the Portland Train Station from its current location on the Mountain Branch (Portland Transportation Center) to the Mainline. Additional details at http://www.trainridersne.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That's interesting, because the whole Thompson's Point project is set up as Transit-Oriented Development with a TIF to match, and the rail connection was a key part of that. They were also going to build a parking garage which the PTC would share.
It's also interesting to see that the wye is no longer in the cards, which explains why MDOT appears ready to sell that land to the city.

I've read similar talk about TOD on the former Blue Rock quarry site at the border of Westbrook, which would also possibly take advantage of the rail track for a connection. Which means that, what could possibly work is:

1. take the whole block from the corner of Congress & St. John, knock down the shopping center. This should give them more than enough room for three tracks through the area, if they don't have it already, which it does look like!)
2. current PTC/Thompson's Point and Rock Row become transfers on a NJT-Princeton Junction shuttle-type service, with a cross-platform transfer at the connection timed to meet the Downeasters.

That area around the tracks is prime potential TOD. Currently it's extremely run-down, but it's within walking distance of two hospitals and the Western Promenade, which is a lovely walk, even in terrible weather. The 1,200 parking spaces seems a bit like a red herring, since there's more room near the current site and it's better connected to the highways - unless they build a multistory parking garage, they're not going to get that kind of space anywhere near the tracks.

dowlingm wrote:Where would this new Portland station be? If the County Jail was relocated, that might work, but there is only 1500 feet between the Branch junction and Congress Street - I would think that more would be needed to put all the pieces in place for a multiplatform mainline station - especially one where one or both platforms was not blocking the main - while preserving the option for a Mountain platform in the future.

A possibility might be to put it at the intersection of St John St. and Park Av. You could buy out Amatos and McDonalds and incorporate McDonalds into a new station or move it to the current Amatos site. There should be enough parking and the bridge over Park Av is 5 tracks wide with only 1 track over it now. There would be plenty of room to add stub tracks for storage and extend the double track over the bridge which now ends just before it. Remove the remnants of the track that used to diverge to the NE and build the station close to Park Av with parking and access along St. John St. Good access to I 95 and Park Av takes you to Old Town and Downtown.

I see zero chance that land will be taken by eminent domain for a new station, and Maine Med has taken all the land near the former Union Station site for its own parking. That leaves the Morrill's Corner area (lots of land, far out of town), or resurrecting the idea of running a new Union Branch along I-295 and putting the station downtown.

Dick H wrote:On a more urgent note than a new Portland station, PAR needs to give consideration to not scheduling
it's through freights between Portland and Plaistow between 5AM and 10AM and 5PM and 10PM, as their
poorly maintained locos and cars are causing lengthy delays for the Downesasters several times a week.
Today, Saturday 4/13
#692 (Sold Out) 3 hours,17 minutes late into Boston, one hour after the Sox game started.
#693 2 hours, 40 minutes, late into Portland.
#696 2 hours, 23 minutes, late into Boston.

The culprit was POAY, which had a car to set out near Kennebunk; however I do not know the reason for the setoff.
Andy

One of NNEPRA's Strategic Goals & Initiatives is to relocate the Portland Train Station from its current location on the Mountain Branch (Portland Transportation Center) to the Mainline.

This meets the definition of insanity. How many times does this have to be evaluated? The only possible move would be to St John Street and would cost tens of millions... and comes with its own set of drawbacks. I particularly like the objection about walking access to downtown. Every practical mainline rail location in Portland is bad for this. Spoiler alert: Portland's downtown is built on a hill. And the closer you try to move a station closer to downtown, the worse it is for the majority of passengers that drive to the station. If the station is "perceived" as disconnected, NNEPRA is not doing their job in managing such perceptions!

As someone who visited Portland as a tourist, I didn't really think the Portland station was out of the way at all, primarily because there was a frequent enough local bus route which went from the station to places close to the touristy areas. It was also easy to discover this bus and where it went without a smartphone, as they had a map and timetables in plain sight upon entering the station from track area.

Also, moving the station seems extra dumb, because they would be breaking an intermodal connection (which has a big draw for people who would take a bus one way and train the other, however their schedule needs shake out).

I agree with the latter which is one major reason why I'm still incredulous at this.

The "running GRIPE" is the reverse move in/out of PTC for trips to/from Brunswick,parking is "Capped" out per MeDOT,and the single platform
at PTC.
The wye option is now out of consideration
Wonder if PAR would also object to this move as well.
There's got to be a land speculator that wants PTC gone for redevelopment pushing this move.

Cowford wrote:

One of NNEPRA's Strategic Goals & Initiatives is to relocate the Portland Train Station from its current location on the Mountain Branch (Portland Transportation Center) to the Mainline.

This meets the definition of insanity. How many times does this have to be evaluated? The only possible move would be to St John Street and would cost tens of millions... and comes with its own set of drawbacks. I particularly like the objection about walking access to downtown. Every practical mainline rail location in Portland is bad for this. Spoiler alert: Portland's downtown is built on a hill. And the closer you try to move a station closer to downtown, the worse it is for the majority of passengers that drive to the station. If the station is "perceived" as disconnected, NNEPRA is not doing their job in managing such perceptions!

The "disconnect" problem could be easily remedied with better public transit links and expended parking options. I always thought NNEPRA / MaineDoTs plan was to expand the existing PTC with an island platform and a connection to the garage at Thompsons point. Are they backtracking on this??

I wonder why the wye option came off the table so suddenly?
The long term fix for parking was supposed to be the garage to be built at Thompson's Point; they're finally moving ahead with relocating Suburban Propane, so I would think the garage would be the next step along with the hotel.

Here's the first story on the prospective move I've seen, from The Forecaster.