Pan Am Southern / Patriot Corridor Discussion

CPF363 wrote:Has anyone heard as to how the tracks will be configured for the Wachusett extension at Fitchburg? The Fitchburg passenger track currently ends right at the station, will this eventually tie into the main line so that trains can run both to the east and to the west? How will the existing #1 and #2 tracks work into all of this? Will the project introduce any new interlockings and if so where? What about the clearance issues for autos and double stacks, limited to only the #2 track, will this be addressed also in the end as part of this project? When will all of the new welded rail be installed and who is going to do it? It will be interesting to see if any of the old rail will find its way west for curve worn rail replacement.

The Construction Phasing Diagram dated 12/5/09 provides answers to your several questions. Remember, December 2009 was long prior to anyone considering rebuilding/re-installing the long unused siding(s) into Newark America (north side of existing main track) and Omnova (south side of existing main track) located nar, or adjacent to, the Wachusett Station location. Answers/responses in the order presented in your post:
1. The current stub end “passenger track” at Fitchburg station will be extended west and connect to the main line at MP 49.65 (approx) via a new #15 Left Hand Turn Out (LHTO). 49.65 is W of Fitchburg Station. Both inbound (east) and outbound (west) trains will access this track using this turnout.
2. “How will the existing #1 and #2 tracks work into all of this?” Left hand Crossover(s) will be installed at MP 51.0 (allowing a WB access from #1 to #2) and MP 53.1 (allowing an EB access to the other track).
3. A LHTO at MP 53.2 will allow WB access/ EB egress from the new Wachusett Station track to/from the existing main line track #1 to #2.
4. A # 15 RHTO at MP 54 will allow a WB to exit Wachusett Station and head to the new layover yard; the opposite for an EB movement.
5. A new # 20 LHTO at MP 55 reduces the two main tracks to single track.
6. A #10 LHTO at MP 55.6 is the start of a (approx) .40 mile long layover facility siding track leading to the proposed new 6 track layover facility.
7. A new #10 RHTO at MP 56.0 allows access/egress to/from the main line on the Westminster/Gardner side of the layover yard.
The plan calls for “Improvements to existing Pan Am track No. 1 including new wood ties, new CWR and OTM, clean and shoulder ballast and selectively undercut track” from (approx) MP 49.5 to MP 55. Much of the CWR was dropped in place alongside the main line during Summer, 2013 and remains in place oxidizing away. Several bridges are scheduled to be “strengthened” as well. Remember, the original announcement of the Wachusett extension called for a completion in “late 2012.” See: http://www.mbta.com/about_the_mbta/news ... /?id=20487" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; “It is estimated that the facility will service over 400 new commuter rail passengers in 2012, and divert 824 vehicle trips from Route 2.” As things are currently progressing an optimistic guess would be a Spring, 2016 project completion at the earliest. Another MBTA web page (See: http://www.mbta.com/about_the_mbta/t_pr ... p?id=25985" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) indicates “Design of the various elements of the project is under way and expected to be complete in 2013. Current project schedule calls for construction to begin with site preparation for the station and layover facility in late 2012. Construction is expected to be complete by the end of 2014.”

Abe Froman wrote:The Construction Phasing Diagram dated 12/5/09 provides answers to your several questions. Remember, December 2009 was long prior to anyone considering rebuilding/re-installing the long unused siding(s) into Newark America (north side of existing main track) and Omnova (south side of existing main track) located nar, or adjacent to, the Wachusett Station location. Answers/responses in the order presented in your post:
1. The current stub end “passenger track” at Fitchburg station will be extended west and connect to the main line at MP 49.65 (approx) via a new #15 Left Hand Turn Out (LHTO). 49.65 is W of Fitchburg Station. Both inbound (east) and outbound (west) trains will access this track using this turnout.
2. “How will the existing #1 and #2 tracks work into all of this?” Left hand Crossover(s) will be installed at MP 51.0 (allowing a WB access from #1 to #2) and MP 53.1 (allowing an EB access to the other track).
3. A LHTO at MP 53.2 will allow WB access/ EB egress from the new Wachusett Station track to/from the existing main line track #1 to #2.
4. A # 15 RHTO at MP 54 will allow a WB to exit Wachusett Station and head to the new layover yard; the opposite for an EB movement.
5. A new # 20 LHTO at MP 55 reduces the two main tracks to single track.
6. A #10 LHTO at MP 55.6 is the start of a (approx) .40 mile long layover facility siding track leading to the proposed new 6 track layover facility.
7. A new #10 RHTO at MP 56.0 allows access/egress to/from the main line on the Westminster/Gardner side of the layover yard.
The plan calls for “Improvements to existing Pan Am track No. 1 including new wood ties, new CWR and OTM, clean and shoulder ballast and selectively undercut track” from (approx) MP 49.5 to MP 55. Much of the CWR was dropped in place alongside the main line during Summer, 2013 and remains in place oxidizing away. Several bridges are scheduled to be “strengthened” as well. Remember, the original announcement of the Wachusett extension called for a completion in “late 2012.” See: http://www.mbta.com/about_the_mbta/news ... /?id=20487" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; “It is estimated that the facility will service over 400 new commuter rail passengers in 2012, and divert 824 vehicle trips from Route 2.” As things are currently progressing an optimistic guess would be a Spring, 2016 project completion at the earliest. Another MBTA web page (See: http://www.mbta.com/about_the_mbta/t_pr ... p?id=25985" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) indicates “Design of the various elements of the project is under way and expected to be complete in 2013. Current project schedule calls for construction to begin with site preparation for the station and layover facility in late 2012. Construction is expected to be complete by the end of 2014.”

So a few follow-on comments and questions:
1. Will the new connection to the main line at MP 49.65 will be a number 1 track only interlocking similar to that of CPF-GL?
2. Will the cross-overs and switches at MP 53.1 and MP 53.2 be part of the same interlocking or separate ones?
3. Is there a reason why at MP 55 (CPF335), where the two main tracks become single track is being re-configured with the new # 20 LHTO. The current switch is a RHTO.
4. The plan calls for “Improvements to existing Pan Am track No. 1 including new wood ties, new CWR and OTM, clean and shoulder ballast and selectively undercut track” from (approx) MP 49.5 to MP 55." Looks like some new CWR was dropped along the the Number 2 track also.
5. Will the Freight Man Line Mattawamkeag, ME to Sunbury, PA mileposts be used west of the Bike Shop, which is MP 329.70 (add 280 to 49.65, etc.) or will the old original mileposts be used up to MP 56?
6. Will Pan Am Southern or the MBTA complete all of the track improvements?

So a few follow-on comments and questions:
1. Will the new connection to the main line at MP 49.65 will be a number 1 track only interlocking similar to that of CPF-GL?
2. Will the cross-overs and switches at MP 53.1 and MP 53.2 be part of the same interlocking or separate ones?
3. Is there a reason why at MP 55 (CPF335), where the two main tracks become single track is being re-configured with the new # 20 LHTO. The current switch is a RHTO.
4. The plan calls for “Improvements to existing Pan Am track No. 1 including new wood ties, new CWR and OTM, clean and shoulder ballast and selectively undercut track” from (approx) MP 49.5 to MP 55." Looks like some new CWR was dropped along the the Number 2 track also.
5. Will the Freight Man Line Mattawamkeag, ME to Sunbury, PA mileposts be used west of the Bike Shop, which is MP 329.70 (add 280 to 49.65, etc.) or will the old original mileposts be used up to MP 56?
6. Will Pan Am Southern or the MBTA complete all of the track improvements?[/quote]

CPF 363—

Among my several flaws is an inability to consistently recall which track is #1 and which is #2. For the purpose of this response it is assumed the #1 track is on the right if an individual were to stand in the centre of the roadbed facing west. As in my earlier response I rely on a Construction Phasing Diagram dated December, 2009 rather than conjecture or speculation. Otherwise, the best guess rule applies. The Phasing Diagram and accompanying Cost Estimate Breakdown are informative insofar as roadbed, ties and rails are concerned, considerably less so insofar as signals and related train control systems are concerned.

Your #1: Connection is to the #1 track only according to the diagram.

Your #2: IDK and the Diagram/Cost Estimate provide no specific insight to allow a definitive response.

Your #3: The Diagram indicates “New #20 LHTO”

Your #4: The Cost Estimate indicates “Furnish and Install (F&I) New Ties:
a. Track No. 1 Fitchburg to Wachusett (MP 49.5 – MP 55: 12 ties/39’ @ $100.00 each
b. Track No. 2 Fitchburg to Wachusett (MP 49.5 – MP 55): 12 ties/39’ 8910 total $891,000.00

F&I New 136 RE CWR and OTM (RelayRail Picked Up Used at other locations where possible:
a. Track No. 1 Fitchburg to Wachusett (MP 49.5-MP54) $600,000.00 per mile $2,700,000.00
b. Track No. 2 Fitchburg to Wachusett (MP 49.5–MP54) $600,000.00 per mile

Your #5: IDK. Best guess is MBTA will simply extend the MP; PAS/ST/B&M will continue with their existing practice. Why change?

Your #6: Different aspects of the total project see different bidders for obvious reasons. Remember, MART and MART’s goofy “experts” wrote and announced the original proposal for bid. Shortly after that disaster the MBTA assumed responsibility for the extension and made several revisions and design changes. Best guess is MBTA sub-contractors will perform the work. However, keep in mind the scope of the Wachusett Extension runs to slightly west of MP64.44.

I find the $100/tie figure interesting. Is that the installed cost?

MEC407 wrote:I would certainly hope so! I had no idea tie jobs were that expensive. Has the cost gone up dramatically in recent times? i.e. doubled or tripled? I can't recall the exact numbers, but it seems like the per-tie cost was significantly lower in 2000-2004 when the Portland-Plaistow and Brunswick-Rockland projects were being done.

If it also includes surfacing I think this number would be pretty reasonable. Since surfacing likely has to be done after a major tie job anyways I wouldn't be surprised if this was the case, especially as it would simplify the budgeting process.

“I find the $100/tie figure interesting. Is that the installed cost?” -gokeefe

“I would certainly hope so! I had no idea tie jobs were that expensive. Has the cost gone up dramatically in recent times? i.e. doubled or tripled? I can't recall the exact numbers, but it seems like the per-tie cost was significantly lower in 2000-2004 when the Portland-Plaistow and Brunswick-Rockland projects were being done.” –MEC407

“If it also includes surfacing I think this number would be pretty reasonable. Since surfacing likely has to be done after a major tie job anyways I wouldn't be surprised if this was the case, especially as it would simplify the budgeting process.” –gokeefe

I believe the previous responses to CPF363’s questions clearly indicated the content was provided relying on data contained in/on a Construction Phasing Diagram prepared during December, 2009 and a Cost Estimate Breakdown of the project and then planned. In addition, my second post contained (within quotation marks) “Furnish and Install (F&I).” That means an estimated $100.00 per tie when 12 ties are purchased and installed within a 39 foot section, i.e. “12 ties/39’ “ A qualified bidder can, obviously, provide a lower cost and, if my recollection is accurate, the project did come in slightly lower than the estimated total cost.

Surfacing and necessary materials/equipment are separate line items on the Cost Estimate Breakdown and are not included in the cost estimate for ties. In addition, the cost estimates per unit for all turnouts and crossovers (estimated price range in 2009: $125,000. – $350,000) includes the necessary extended length ties.

Abe,

Thanks for the clarification!

Abe, thanks kindly for your responses, clears up a number of questions. You have it correct, if you are at Fitchburg Station and looking west, the No. 1 track would be to your right and the No. 2 track would be to your left. The Fitchburg Passenger track would be to your far right.

...and not very many are laughing...

jaymac wrote:...and not very many are laughing...

...and most particularly not laughing would be NS...

Anyone care to explain what 'CPF 384 mess' is all about?
S

EDMO ripped up the mainline/main access to the yard from the westbound main.