Original CRR of NJ operations in Jersey City

Does anyone here have info of the operation of the CRR of NJ prior to opening of their first Jersey City Terminal. Back when they used the NJRR cut to access the Hudson.
question
Did they share the NJRR ( New Jersey Railroad and Transportation Co.) 1st terminal, or just go to the river, and stop, and tell everyone to get off the train, and take the ferry ?
** * This may go back to the Elizabethtown and Summerville, and predate the CRR of NJ. I am not sure.
** * I have seen, on a Map, their first roundhouse in Jersey City. It was closer to Montgomery street then it was to Communipaw.

"On December 1, 1859, the CNJ arranged to run over the New Jersey Rail Road to the latter's terminal in Jersey City. That operation began December 19, and included a third rail for DL&W trains.
The CNJ's extension to its new terminal in Jersey City, including the first CRRNJ Newark Bay Bridge, opened on July 29, 1864, with a ferry transfer to Cortlandt Street in New York City, ending operations over the NJRR. On July 23, 1869, the Newark and New York Railroad opened, providing a straight route from downtown Newark to the CNJ's Jersey City terminal"
source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_R ... New_Jersey" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;"
"1853 to 1859; New Jersey Railroad and Transportation Company original Jersey City terminal: Job Male, six year Superintendent of Construction of the NJRR, 1853–1859, built this complete terminal in Jersey City. He was designer and builder of terminal, docks, ferry houses, and piers, and possibly the Maintenance facility between Washington and Green streets built during his term as Superintendent. Reclaiming the natural river front, which included all that section of Hudson Street lying between Essex and Wayne Streets. He planned and built for the company the old circular-roofed depot, which was 500' in length and 100' wide, and which was situated on Montgomery street where the 1858 Pennsylvania Railroad depot was built.[44]"
http://mapmaker.rutgers.edu/1872Atlas/H ... kUnion.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
"Jersey City, Ist and 2nd terminal, NJRR, opened 1834.
1848_NJRR_-_Copy.jpg - 104112 Bytes
« on: Dec 14th, 2015, 10:46am » Quick-Jump Reply w/Quote Modify
* Most information in any book covering this first 1834 terminal or the following second 1857 terminal had derogatory things to say about these two terminal. Always comparing the first terminal to the large big city stations built 20 to 30 years later on. Information printed in the Book " From the "Hills to the Hudson" on page 179 has two of the three period drawings to be found of this first terminal. The top Drawing is incomplete and basic. It is noted on this page that this station, as it appears opened in 1834. At the time of its opening the drawing shows a 3 track train shed, which for 1834 is large. This terminal when opened had no head house, and was continually added to, as for of 1848 drawing below, as shown in the book on page 178 (same book), a head house is there at this time. This 1848 drawing shows this more complete terminal.
* It was built by the New Jersey Rail Road and Transportation Co. as their Jersey City terminal. The first in New Jersey on the Hudson River. Located on Hudson street between Montgomery and Mercier Streets. In the same place as the PRR would build its Exchange place terminal, which was the forth or fifth terminal built there. The third terminal built in this location was built by the PRR. It lasted about a year or so. So many Jersey City PRR stations were catching on fire that I couldn't keep track of which was which. In addition a view of the headhouse from the riverside is shown on a 1884 map of Jersey City. It show a squared off front tall columns like a Ancient Greek or Roman building would have."
http://forums.railfan.net/forums.cgi?ac ... 85;start=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The NJRR&TCo.second terminal is said to have opened in 1857. This info is from the report from the Directors to Stockholders dated 1857. A beautiful drawing of the New Terminal was attached to this report. This is the Terminal the PRR seems to have said they had built. Everything I read says the New Jersey Rail Road was this terminals builder. I read a little-known bit of information concerning one of the first companies to lay track down into Bayonne and along its eastern shore, and also paralleling the Morris Canal westward across Jersey City to Newark Bay was the NJRR. Nothing I have read is said as to why this was done. Also, the third rail which was placed in the cut between the Marrion Station ( the Patterson and Hudson River station) and the NJRR Jersey City terminal was done through an agreement with the Erie Railroad to allow its 6-foot gauge equipment access to the Hudson River terminal. I don't remember anything about the DL&W using the cut. Five or six other railroads did use the cut and the terminal. Maybe the DL&W did also. With info this old, you can't find it all.
frank

Where did the CNJ (or whatever is was called back then) connect to the NJRR to get to the NJRR Bergen Hill cut and the Jersey City terminal? One would assume at their crossing in Elizabeth, but you never know...
JS

toptrain wrote:... I don't remember anything about the DL&W using the cut. Five or six other railroads did use the cut and the terminal. Maybe the DL&W did also. With info this old, you can't find it all.
frank

In the early days of the DL&W, when they first bought the Warren RR to get into NJ, coming from the west the DLW went from Portland PA, down through Washington NJ through Changewater NJ, ending at Hampton Junction on the CNJ, just west of High Bridge and Glen Gardner on the CNJ. The DLW ended there, and used the CNJ to get to the Jersey City area, in part to deliver coal from PA. This is in the 1856 time frame. This required the CNJ to lay a 3rd rail for the broad gauge DLW traffic, if I have it right. So if the CNJ was using the NJRR Bergen hill cut (which the above posts describe) and the DLW was going not just to ELizabeth but to Jersey City, a 3rd rail would have been required for the DLW in the NJRR cut.

Also, in the early Erie days , from the 1830's its predecessor the Paterson and Hudson River RR used the NJRR cut. The Erie took it over around 1852 for a direct route to the NJ waterfront, so a broad-gauge track would have been put in then already). THis was before the Erie built their "Long Dock" tunnel through Bergen Hill around 1860). So a wide gauge track was almost certainly in the NJRR cut down to the waterfront before the DLW/CNJ needed one in 1856 . However in 1856 I'm guessing a wide gauge track probably was added on the NJRR from Elizabeth (where I assume the CNJ connected) through Newark to the cut. I've read both the Erie and DLW were 6-foot gauge.

The CNJ and DLW almost merged, but something went sour, so in 1869 the DLW leased the Morris and Essex RR to get its own route to the NJ waterfront, connecting at Washington, and going to Hoboken eventually. The M&E route to Hoboken probably used the NJRR cut before its DLW lease. The early M&E ended in Newark and passengers transferred to the NJRR at Center St - and I think some M&E trains may have used the NJRR Center St bridge too eventually. But by the time of the lease, the M&E had their own route across the meadowlands and was already using the Erie Long Dock tunnel, then later the DLW's own tunnel, but no longer the NJRR. When the DLW leased the M&E, the DLW didn't use the CNJ anymore and presumably the 3rd rail on the CNJ (and the NJRR) was removed.

For a while the CNJ also carried Lehigh Valley RR coal from Phillipsburg to the Hudson waterfront, before the LV extended on their own across NJ. I don't know if that went via the NJRR connection or right to ELizabeth, but in any case I think that was all standard gauge

JS

* In response to the post by pumpers » Thu Aug 03, 2017 10:16 am, about additional tracks this post was made.

Ref; “The Railway and Locomotive Historical Society, Bulletin 88” page 151.

Fourth Paragraph.;
“Another phase of the New Jersey Company’s construction program was the adaptation
Of various sections of its track to carry the trains of other railroads into the Jersey City terminal. By 1861 five railroads besides the New Jersey Road - - the New York and Erie, the Morris and Essex, the Central of New Jersey, The Northern, and the Hackensack and New York Railroad were running their cars over New Jersey’s rails. The roadbed of the New Jersey Railroad, from Elizabeth to Jersey City was able to carry cars of three different gauges - - four foot ten inch, four foot eleven and a half inch, and six foot. In 1861, the average daily traffic across the Meadows and through Bergen Hill cut to the depot was 112 trains from the six roads, all of which were subject to operating rules on the New Jersey company to prevent accidents from possible conflicting regulations of the various roads.
* I copied the exact text from that reference source. Similar information is available in John Cunningham's book "Railroads of New Jersey" on page 60. The track gauges are not mentioned there only the road names.
frank