• Idling locomotives -- Pan Am may do something about it

  • Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.
Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.

Moderator: MEC407

  by MEC407
 
After re-reading the article, it sounds like the original idea came from the Devens Enterprise Commission, and that the DEC then approached the Montachusett Regional Planning Commission and the towns of Ayer, Shirley, and Havard, to sign on as well.
DEC Administrative Director Peter Lowitt says his office approached Pan Am to see if they'd be interested in participating in the EPA Clean Diesel Grant program. The EPA will fund up to six $1 million grants for clean diesel projects in the region.The DEC enlisted MRPC for the grant writing assist.
...
Other towns signing off on a municipal letter in support of the grant are Shirley and Harvard...
It doesn't look like Pan Am asked for anything. But it also doesn't look like they're saying no, either.

Re:

  by NV290
 
oibu wrote: SMALL DIESEL ENGINES? What do they do, extend the long hood like on a HEP-generator commuter unit?

Wouldn't it make more sense to just use a Kim Hotstart or similar system (you, know- liek everyone else does???) else that just fires the unit up automatically when temp drops below a certain point, idles it until it warms up, then shuts 'er down again? Seems like a cheaper, more efficient, lower-maintenance system...
The small layover diesel systems have gotten so small they can fit on a walkway (on 6 axle units) in it's own enclosure or it fits at the rear of the locomotive under the frame. It's not a big engine. Just big enough to run a generator.

The Kim Hotstart systems are worthless for freight units. They are 100% electric units. They require 440VAC at a minimum. Great for Passenger equipment that is normally plugged into ground power at a facility. But completely impractical for freight units. Which is why they are virtually unheard of on real freight railroads.

Many railroads have gone to an Autostart system that automatically start and stops the locomotives prime mover as needed to maintain water tempature and air pressure. They also monitor battery volatge and will not shut the prime mover down if the batteries are low. The ZTR Smart Start system is one of the better known versions. While these systems are cheaper then layover type genset diesel systems, the downside is the wear and tear on the locomotive's prime mover. And you are relying on the locomotive batteries. But because of the lower initial cost both to buy and install, they are the most popular systems out there for freight units.

Pan Am's loco's are in such bad shape, an Auto Start system would never work. Most PAR loco's cannot even be shut down because the batteries are dead. This includes the ones that have the layover systems. Those diesel genset units are not powerful enough to "jumpstart" a locomotive. They are only designed to maintain a charge. But to maintain a charge, you need to have good batteries. Which is why the vast majority of PAR units with the genset's are not even using the gensets. The other issues lies is PAR did not get the gensets that monitor air pressure. So if you leave a train unnatended with a Genset, it will shut the loco down and will not restart it when air pressure gets low. So the trains often lose the brake test. the way PAR parks trains for sometimes days on end, this is yet another reason why they gensets are not used. I know at least one of the genets is blown. Ran out of oil. PAR got them for free so they installed them. But they are barely utilized.

The next issue is the 500 series PAR units. They cannot get gensets because there is no place to mount them. The design of them has the batteries mounted under the radiators where the genset would normally go. So they would need some specialized type. Specialized = expensive. So do not expect any 500's to get gensets any time soon.
  by CN9634
 
NV290 wrote:The small layover diesel systems have gotten so small they can fit on a walkway (on 6 axle units) in it's own enclosure or it fits at the rear of the locomotive under the frame. It's not a big engine. Just big enough to run a generator.

The Kim Hotstart systems are worthless for freight units. They are 100% electric units. They require 440VAC at a minimum. Great for Passenger equipment that is normally plugged into ground power at a facility. But completely impractical for freight units. Which is why they are virtually unheard of on real freight railroads.

The next issue is the 500 series PAR units. They cannot get gensets because there is no place to mount them. The design of them has the batteries mounted under the radiators where the genset would normally go. So they would need some specialized type. Specialized = expensive. So do not expect any 500's to get gensets any time soon.
The Montreal, Maine and Atlantic uses Kim Hotstart systems on a few of its locomotives (I know the 8569 and 8578 have those units installed). Also point of information, are you refering to the APU when you say genset? I am a bit confused by the wording as I am under the impression that a Genset is a type of locomotive not a hotstart system.
  by MEC407
 
"Genset" simply means an engine/generator set... which can be a little motor/generator used to keep a locomotive warm (as is the case with an auxiliary power unit [APU]), or it can also be a fairly large engine/generator set, or several of them, as is the case with so-called "genset locomotives."
  by NV290
 
CN9634 wrote:The Montreal, Maine and Atlantic uses Kim Hotstart systems on a few of its locomotives (I know the 8569 and 8578 have those units installed).
I said "Real Freight railroads" The MMA does not fall under that realm. They are so small they can park loco's at points where power has been provided. Class 1's and large regionals, like PAR are far too big to make such a system feasible. I's hard enough to get 110VAC out most outlying points, 440 is an even bigger challenge, and hazard. That is why it's not used. PAR actually has 2 units running around with HotStart systems installed. But they have not been used in years. They used to get plugged in on the Hot Start track in Lowell. But it became too much of a hassle.
CN9634 wrote:Also point of information, are you refering to the APU when you say genset? I am a bit confused by the wording as I am under the impression that a Genset is a type of locomotive not a hotstart system.
Yes, reffering to APU's. That is what an APU is, a Genset. While i undertand there are loco's called Gensets, this topic is not about them so i fuigured there would be no confusion issue. Sorry about that.
  by calaisbranch
 
By chance, are these "Kim Hotstart" units the boxes behind the conductor's seat with the mini-exhaust stacks? I noticed them on the mentioned MMA locos, 8569 and 78 last week at NMJ. The main prime mover units, themselves, weren't idling. How deep into a Winter are these things dependable?
  by NV290
 
calaisbranch wrote:By chance, are these "Kim Hotstart" units the boxes behind the conductor's seat with the mini-exhaust stacks? I noticed them on the mentioned MMA locos, 8569 and 78 last week at NMJ. The main prime mover units, themselves, weren't idling. How deep into a Winter are these things dependable?
Not sure what you saw behind the cab. They may have been some sort of layover system, but without a pic, i could not say for sure.

Untill recently, Kim Hotstart was known for making strictly electric layover systems. They have since added a diesel unit to thier product line. But when most people say "Kim Hotstart" or simply "Hotstart" system, they are talking about an externally powered electric layover system. A Hostart system can be ordered in many ways. The basic system just heats the water. But you can add oil heating, fuel heating and battery chargers. The more options, the higher the cost to buy, the higher the cost to install and the higher the cost to run. But if you had very cold winters, they would be worth it.

As far as diesel layover systems, different manufacturers have different claims for how low a tempature they can protect against. But in most cases, i would imagine that the railroad would simply opt to leave the prime mover running in super cold weather.
  by MEC407
 
NV290 wrote:Not sure what you saw behind the cab. They may have been some sort of layover system, but without a pic, i could not say for sure.
I think he was talking about this: http://naphotos.nerail.org/s/?p=157526

It's the box directly aft the cab, with what appears to be an exhaust pipe and muffler coming up out of it.
  by NV290
 
MEC407 wrote:I think he was talking about this: http://naphotos.nerail.org/s/?p=157526

It's the box directly aft the cab, with what appears to be an exhaust pipe and muffler coming up out of it.
Yes, that appears to be a diesel genset type layover unit. The ones we have on NS units have a much smaller exhaust that blows out the side, but the dimensions are the same.
  by Guilford Guy9887
 
I was just looking out my window watching a southbound freight and notice the lone guilford painted unit MEC 319, had a Beacon installed near the dynamic brakes. I looked at some pics on rrpictures.com and it isn't in any of the pictures. Is pan am doing this to there whole fleet?
  by newpylong
 
APU upgrades are part of cycling up to Waterville.
  by KSmitty
 
The beacon (as in the light behind the D/B blister http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... ?id=640593 ) denotes an APU installation?
I figured it was just a hold over from their time on CR...

Is APU installation still part of every rebuild? What percent of the fleet has them now?

And twp more questions if I may, older posts on here mentioned that the 500's wouldn't fit an APU and that the APU's being installed would keep the block warm, but wouldn't keep the air up in the line. Did they find a work around for the 500's and did new APU installations include the ability to charge air?
  by newpylong
 
Yup, it's an APU. Sorry I don't have the answer for the rest of your questions... from what I remember they didn't restart the engine when the main res got low like the factory APU's on the big RR's, but it's been a while.
  by MEC407
 
They're now building their own APUs in-house. I'm not sure if the locomotives with home-built APUs have beacons or not, but I wouldn't necessarily rely on that as a spotting feature. The SD40-2 they had on display at Freeport this summer had a home-built APU (the engine room doors were open so visitors could see it). I don't recall seeing a beacon on that locomotive, but maybe I just missed it.