CR on the Southern Secondary

Jitney driver told me this. The engine thing I may have seen on Friday too. Almost no engines in Oak Island and Port Newark except for road power.

CR2721 wrote: ↑Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:05 pm R&DB, They are West in Manchester

So the Whiting area. They won't hear real train horns until NJSL starts sand trains. Watch thie topic and the CMSL non-passenger topic.

Main Street crossing gates were busted a few hours ago in Farmingdale. They were angled at about 75 degrees, with the gate lights flashing every couple of minutes instead of flashing every couple of seconds. Did not block traffic, but it caused traffic as many motorists were rightfully worried about going around them.

Whoever ends up doing maintenance/running this line with whatever grants are being handed out, has a long list of things to do.

That’s concerning. Normally that road doesn’t have issues.

Speaking of issues...

How. HOW does this train stay on the track?! I was able to get a better look at it for once since they came down early in the afternoon. Some sections of rail pick up off the ground in between train cars by like 4-6 inches, there’s hardly ANY solid ties left, the bridges in Lakewood bow downwards by like 3 inches when the train goes over them, and another one has an 8-10 foot section of track where there’s no ties or spikes, and a 30 foot section where the train leans 3 feet to one side!!

Whoever is gonna be taking this line over needs to do ASAP and begin repairs immediately. It’s only a matter of time before this line sees a major accident, and I honestly think that Conrail is gonna abandon this very soon if someone doesn’t take it over.

The grant is pretty obvious that CR wants nothing to do with the line... at this moment. I don't think CR wants to deal with the local trains. Per a PowerPoint and discussion in the 2021 grant thread, CR has an interest in possibly using the old Southern from Winslow-Woodmansie as a thoroughfare. Obviously, that would be ludicrously expensive, however, having some other companies maintain/restore/upgrade trackage in multiple spots slowly over time would significantly reduce CR's costs if they ever pursue the project.

Lakehurst is the border for Conrail South Jersey and North Jersey. Anything past Lakehurst freightwise would (mercifully) be under Conrail South Jersey. I’m just not sure if SJ would run it just as a transfer between Camden and Lakehurst.

If they got all of the Browns locals as part of it though they would do it in a heartbeat. Then they could even have the transfer come out of Winslow and not Oak Island, so no NJT to worry about.

Then they could even have the transfer come out of Winslow and not Oak Island, so no NJT to worry about.

It would probably be more benificial to rebuild the Canden & Amboy between Bordentown and Cranbury Station. That would gve tham a direct route from Pavonia to Browns. CR already has rights on the Riverline at night.

Another one should never been abandoned. No way they're going thru Hightstown now! Maybe around it?

@Bracdude181
Personally, my definition of where North Jersey ends (no matter what you believe on if Central Jersey exists or not), is the Raritan River. Maybe CR South Jersey can use the fact that CR North Jersey is seemingly backing out of Browns with this grant to their advantage.

@R&DB
Unfortunately, the old C&A is long gone. If you follow the old ROW between Bordentown and Cranbury station, there are plenty of residential and industrial structures that are occupying the land. The area has gotten so developed that there is really no detour around it. They would have to viciously use eminent domain or buy each property normally.

I believe the issue they were raising in the PowerPoint (https://www.njtpa.org/NJTPA/media/Docum ... 041921.pdf) was that there's no *direct* connection to Southeastern Jersey. The Riverline, like the NEC, hugs the extreme western side of South Jersey, and also has NJT/Amtrak sharing issues.

Not sure why they are looking at Winslow-Woodmansie if they already have the NEC and the Riverline. Maybe they are looking for something that won't have speed nor time limits?

@CharlieL
The state of railroads is due to the very short-sightedness of companies and (mostly) the government not too long ago. We are paying dearly for it.
Not sure if there's any short go-around that is possible. Especially with the cost of land/real-estate these days!

The only other route besides the CSX Trenton Subdivision that goes to Oak Island is the Northeast Corridor. You could use this as the line is good for Plate F but unsure about 286k cars. Might need to strengthen some bridges?

Only thing is, I think Amtrak has some sort of fee freight companies have to pay to use their tracks. On NJT they pay per mile, but I’m not sure how Amtrak does it.

Plus, the corridor can be fairly chaotic sometimes. Especially with how often NJT has been breaking down on it. So any sort of big Camden-Oak Island transfer would have to be at night

I'd rather see Browns served from Morrisville than Camden or Oak Island.
You could rebuild the remaining part of the Bordentown Sec from Port on the NEC to the connection to the River Line in Trenton to reach Camden, but that leaves an almost impossible window to get from Camden to Browns and back in the same night.

There is probably less than 10 cars a year that need to move between Oak Island and Camden. Either it goes via CSX Philly to Camden or it Goes NS via Allentown-Abrams-Camden, depends on who's account the car is under.

CR7876 wrote: ↑Mon Dec 13, 2021 4:43 pm There is probably less than 10 cars a year that need to move between Oak Island and Camden. Either it goes via CSX Philly to Camden or it Goes NS via Allentown-Abrams-Camden, depends on who's account the car is under.

How come NJTPSA was emphasizing not only maintaining the ROW of Winslow-Woodmansie (or any North-South corridor), but also reactivating it?

I don't know its not really needed. Looks like they are more worried about just having one for the sake of having one. It clearly says the " Blue Comet" route is not the best solution. I agree.

I hear a train horn in Farmingdale at 5:04PM. Assuming the train is making its trek back right now.

EDIT: It is indeed passing through Farmingdale. 5:07 PM.

How do they stay on the tracks on the Southern? Well, then I have to ask, how does this train stay on the tracks....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9X2A2f6E5DI

Vertical movement (up & down) is ok as long as the track is in gauge (56.5 inches from the interior of one railhead to the interior of the other). It's the lateral movement (side to side) that is killer and repeated lateral movement can spread the rails and cause derailments. Before you go complaining that the track in the video is just like the Southern, it is not. It may be in another 5 years if no wood is installed (minimally at least one tie in every 4 or 5), but now it is FRA safe. It passes track inspection every year, and you can't argue with the inspectors.

Chris