• Arkansas and Missouri Centuries near the end?

  • Discussion of products from the American Locomotive Company. A web site with current Alco 251 information can be found here: Fairbanks-Morse/Alco 251.
Discussion of products from the American Locomotive Company. A web site with current Alco 251 information can be found here: Fairbanks-Morse/Alco 251.

Moderator: Alcoman

  by joydivision350125
There seems to be a rumor circulating that Arkansas and Missouri will be phasing out the Alcos over the next few years in favor of GP38s/GP38-2s.
I first read this on the LAL yahoogroup page, and have heard a few other mutterings since.


Thanks all,

Jeff Ellis

  by Railpac
Boy, I hope this rumor isn't true! That would bite, the largest surviving fleet of C-420s, to vanish. But they just purchased those BRC C-424s, 3 of them, how would the decision effect them? If the rumor is true, then I guess I am getting my license just in time, I will HAVE to make a road trip down there (only in St.L) to see them before they vanish forever. :( :(

  by Urban D Kaye
Well, if the rumor IS true...this would be the time for a savvy group of fans to round up some financial backing, purchase and rehab a few miles of abandoned L&HR ROW, buy the A&M fleet, and establish an all-Alco scenic railway in North Jersey.

I can dream, can't I?

  by missthealcos
Whoa, that is not good potential news.....I hope it isn't true.

Someone with some authority please tell us this is not true...

  by Alcoman
I belong to the LA&L group and I either missed this or it was posted along time ago. When did this get posted on the LA&L group?

  by Sandy Burton

The A&M Alco demise discussion was part of the WNY&P 426 discussion. Original message from Eric, who I suspect got the information from Kermit G. since he was out there recently. Date was around June 16 or 17.


  by txbritt
I don't really buy into that. I used to work for the A & M about a year ago, and we didn't really have any major problems with the 420's while I was there. I recall doing routine TM changes, and a turbo in #46. I don't see the Alco's being retired given the amount of spare parts they have stocked there, the three recently acquired 424's, and with C-420, #442(?) sitting nearby waiting for her turn to run. I knew Casey, and the management and they all loved the locomotives. To speak of replacing them with EMD's or GE's was blasphemy, I know because I kidded once and was given a really nasty look!

Granted, things may have changed but it would have had to have been all of the sudden.

Just my $0.05


  by Alcoman
I hope you are right! This maintenance cycle thing is rather full of holes anyway since I heard from a number of railroaders that Alco require fewer heavy overhauls than EMD's.

So even if the A&M chooses to do routine maintenance on a 30 day cycle, I think that could be considered extra PM rather than required maintenance. Much like changing oil in a car every 3,000 miles instead of 5-7,000 miles that are spelled out in the owners manual.

  by TerryC
If the ALCo's were retired I would be disappointed, but it is the 21st century. No offense, but those locomotive are out dated technology and no matter how beautiful something is you some times have to give it up.

"keep searching keep finding

  by txbritt
Outdated or not, for a shortline railroad with a limited budget, that may very well be the way to go. Besides, is a 30 year old GP38-2 any more sophisticated than a completely re-engined, and rewired C420? The maintenance on the 420's have been impeccable compared to some of the "rode hard, and put up wet" examples of newer power by the Class I's.

I just don't see the technology aspect making any real difference.

Something else I failed to mention last night when I first posted. Would it not be extremely expensive to purchase and stock all the equipment needed for maintenance and upkeep on a single EMD unit? What about employee training who have never laid they're hands on one?

Just my opinion. If Casey hadn't been insulted, he may have added to the conversation. As an ex A&M employee I can only comment on the status of the situation as of a year ago.

  by krobar
When did the A&M change management? This is the first I've heard of this. :(

  by ALCO C-420
OK This has gone on long enough, the ALCO are not being replaced! I am however looking for some more power to add to the fleet. We are going threw some growing pains and I'm just looking. I sure wouldn't replace the ALCO's, and surly not with a 35 year old Geep. As far as the maintences go we have always done a 45 day maintence for extra insurance. The cost is not that much for better performence. I not sure who the A&M source is but you might want to find another source. Did that answer most of your questions? Everything at the A&M is the same just bigger trains and more of them.


  by Alcoman
Welcome back to the forum!
Thank you Casey for putting that rumor to rest!
I am glad to hear that the railroad is growing. I hope that you will be able to find a few more Alcos to add to your wonderful roster. I know that thare are not many left, but I am sure there may some.


  by missthealcos
Great news!

  by bystander
The 251 is a newer design than the EMD 567, the 654 and 710 are based on the 567. 1936?