Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.

Moderator: MEC407

User avatar
NHV 669
Posts: 899
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2014 11:07 pm
Location: Off the long abandoned BC&M to Bethlehem

Re: Hoosac Tunnel problems

Post by NHV 669 »

Train has made its power swap and headed west from HJ, as posted elsewhere by a local observer.
Last edited by NHV 669 on Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
Casey
Avatar: NHVT 669 sits at the south end of the "Pompy" line in White River Jct., VT on 4/29/1993. Photo by Richard Roberg.

Is there a sight worse than a rabid foamer sprinting towards your clean photo/video angle with a tripod, so he can set up two feet from the rails?

JoeCollege
Posts: 222
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 10:52 am
Location: Put in the corner by Otto.

Re: Hoosac Tunnel problems

Post by JoeCollege »

Can anyone point me to a good map of the region so I can get a sense of these moves and what they'll look like? I haven't found one that seems to accurately depict all of the involved properties, but then again, I don't know the area or involved lines well enough to know if I what I find is accurate....

User avatar
NHV 669
Posts: 899
Joined: Sat Feb 08, 2014 11:07 pm
Location: Off the long abandoned BC&M to Bethlehem

Re: Hoosac Tunnel problems

Post by NHV 669 »

Eastbounds would divert onto the B&R at HJ, head north to Rutland. Head east/south down the GMRC to BF, then south onto the CV until they reach the Conn. River line in Northfield, MA, taking that back to ED. Westbounds, the same in reverse like last night.

http://www.vermontrailway.com/maps/vtr_map.html
Casey
Avatar: NHVT 669 sits at the south end of the "Pompy" line in White River Jct., VT on 4/29/1993. Photo by Richard Roberg.

Is there a sight worse than a rabid foamer sprinting towards your clean photo/video angle with a tripod, so he can set up two feet from the rails?

User avatar
MEC407
Posts: 10991
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:15 pm

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by MEC407 »

From WWLP:
WWLP wrote:NORTH ADAMS, Mass. (WWLP) – The Hoosac Tunnel is currently closed to trains because of debris on the tracks.

Pan Am railways Executive Vice President Cynthia Scarano told 22News that the track is temporarily out of service. Scarano said there was a washout involving dirt and rocks, but would not classify it as a collapse of the structure. The company says it is a track and maintenance review situation.

Structural engineers who specialize in railroad tunnels have been called in for an inspection and to make an evaluation. Pan Am will make a plan on rerouting train traffic and repairs pending the result of the evaluation.
Read more at: https://www.wwlp.com/news/hoosac-tunnel ... valuation/
MEC407
Moderator:
Pan Am Railways — Boston & Maine/Maine Central — Delaware & Hudson
Central Maine & Quebec/Montreal, Maine & Atlantic/Bangor & Aroostook
Providence & Worcester — New England — GE Locomotives

Backshophoss
Posts: 6630
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:58 pm

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by Backshophoss »

This collapse might turn into a long term rehab of the tunnel,if all of the brick liner needs to be replaced.
Might be a good time to rebuild to clear double stacks if possible.
The Land of Enchantment is not Flyover country!

User avatar
MEC407
Posts: 10991
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:15 pm

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by MEC407 »

Something like this was bound to happen eventually. The drainage issues have been problematic for many years and certainly weren't going to get better on their own. The tunnel is 145 years old; 150th anniversary coming up in five years.
MEC407
Moderator:
Pan Am Railways — Boston & Maine/Maine Central — Delaware & Hudson
Central Maine & Quebec/Montreal, Maine & Atlantic/Bangor & Aroostook
Providence & Worcester — New England — GE Locomotives

jaymac
Posts: 3941
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2009 1:08 pm

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by jaymac »

To be Captain Obvious, the NS response should provide a metric for commitment to PAS.
"A gray crossover is not company transportation."

bostontrainguy
Posts: 1719
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:14 am

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by bostontrainguy »

Backshophoss wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:25 pm
This collapse might turn into a long term rehab of the tunnel,if all of the brick liner needs to be replaced.
Might be a good time to rebuild to clear double stacks if possible.
Yeah I thought the same thing. This may accelerate the double-stack project so could it be a good thing in the long run?
Last edited by bostontrainguy on Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

NellsChoo
Posts: 1256
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 3:52 pm
Location: Middlesex County, MA

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by NellsChoo »

One wonders just what the inspection schedule/process is for the tunnel these days. Better than under the "B&M" alone, I hope.
It is still GUILFORD to me... http://www.newenglanddepot.net

J.D. Lang
Posts: 193
Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 7:55 am
Location: Between the Housy and Naugy

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by J.D. Lang »

From the books I've read on the Hoosac the whole western 1/3 of the tunnel had to go through a lot of very unstable rock with lots of water penetration hence the need to brick arch for a good part of that section. Those brick linings must be pretty deteriorated after all those years of water, coal and diesel smoke. This could be an indication that things are starting to fail which doesn't bode well.

Question, what ever happened to the state studies on the rehab and DS clearance project from years back? If this tunnel is in this bad of shape I hope that MassDot can help with this as they did on the B&A with their DS clearances.
J. Lang

Safetee
Posts: 361
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2010 8:07 am

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by Safetee »

it might be an ideal time to consider replacing the the conventional track system with StarTrak concrete track modules. the StarTrak system provides a more stable track modulus and can facilitate lowering the track structure by a foot.

Pj
Posts: 254
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:06 pm

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by Pj »

You do realize their products are essentially grade crossings, pits, inspections and the such? They are not geared towards miles of mainline. Nor do they permit drainage that is needed and that if you have a wheel down or with defect, you are ripping up a bunch on concrete - whereas you can swap out a wood tie and tamp
Ballast without much of an issue.

We recently had a wheel down incident where concrete ties were installed and all had to be scrapped. With the solution you presented, it would have been a much costly repair.

Safetee
Posts: 361
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2010 8:07 am

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by Safetee »

well it seems to work well at mount whittier
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcKkGGF ... ex=37&t=0s

Pj
Posts: 254
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:06 pm

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by Pj »

It’s a vehicle / train tunnel and is designed for drainage and has other features that allows it.

Hoosac does not.

Pj
Posts: 254
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:06 pm

Re: Hoosac Tunnel Discussion & News

Post by Pj »

I’ll put it this way - I operate over Sherman Hill. Our twin bore Hermosa tunnel is under 2500ft long, has maybe 50ft of earth on top, is a dry climate - and we have water draining from the roof year round.

It took MOW over a month to try to improve drainage for the water that comes out of there to replace ties and track - and we still have water that empties out on both end.

The Hoosaic is miles long, under much more earth, is more porous - and experiences less cold that we do / so water / ice and the actual composition of the earth is a giant sponge that leaks.

SP delt with many ice jams in the tunnels/snow sheds that hav derailed cars and locomotive. They went back to simple ballast and operations.

Just pouring concrete that will not cure correctly and running tonnage and trains more sizable than what ARR runs isn’t a comparison.

Return to “Pan Am Railways (formerly Guilford Rail System)”