Illinois Amtrak Service

bmichel5581 wrote:Amtrak has best March ever. 17 months of growth....two of three Illinois corridors post all time ridership highs


March 2011:
St. Louis : 57,070
Carbondale : 28,087

Quincy : 19,243

Summer (July especially) is going to be a wild ride if we are posting these kinds of numbers in March.

Let's just hope that this is not a "We lose money on each passenger we carry, but make it up in volume..."

8^)

As noted above and on the Amtrak Success Stories thread ridership is very high right now especially in Illinois.

Just exactly how close are the Illinois services to running out of capacity?

Are we talking about trains that are running crush loads seven days a week or some other kind of ridership pattern?

In short how much more can these trains grow?

If they do grow beyond current capacity does Amtrak have enough cars entering the fleet from ARRA rebuilds to cover potential growth?

Mr. O'Keefe, the reality of $5/ga (that's what Premium runs out here; that's all my buggy drinks) is going to change travel habits - and I can only foresee that Amtrak will be the main beneficiary, as fuel represents considerably less of the cost for a seat-mile of Amtrak transportation than anyone else - commercial or private.

From a round trip to Detroit (the Detroit Symphony is back from the strike, but I fear this magnificent ensemble is not long for this world - I wanted to go for a concert and show my support) this past weekend, the loadings of 350(23)'s five car consist were "strong' (Business Class was sold); this despite a 60M delay 'at the gate' because P-42's 126 sandbox was not working properly (maybe some of our CHI T&E can better report the details) and losing another 30M 'over the road' (the usual; a "torturous" ride to Porter, good running on Amtrak's own to K'Zoo, then back to inexplicably slow running over much of the NS to Detroit). For the return on 353(24), there was an additional A-I in the consist, but an equally strong loading. Again lots of slow running over the NS and 30M lost "over the road'. However being Easter, "not much doing" Porter-CHI; so arrival was only 8ML - and with plenty of time for me to make the 440P BNSF 1315 home.

All told, the 100% Federally funded Wolverine seems like a 'slow train' which is unlike the Locally funded Lincoln, Hiawatha, or Zephyr services. But I did learn that there is actually a scenic vista on the route - that is running along the Huron River through Ann Arbor - and featured at 0:43 of the "Amtrak 40 years" video linked at another topic.

Finally now that the the transportation contract is complete, the fare paid (BizCl both ways) was $130.10; my auto gets 26mpg highway so "do the math" - but don't forget to throw in $25 for parking at Book-Cadillac Hotel in Detroit.

As a side note and since it is partially supported by the state of Illinois, in talking with one of my contacts, it was reported that 332(25) [8:00 Hiawatha service departure from Milwaukee] was at standing room only with a 6 car set...

Again referencing Mr. O'Keefe's thoughts, even though my reservations regarding acquiring Talgo equipment for the Hiawatha service remain unchanged, when the two sets are placed in service (who knows, maybe Wisconsin Gov. Walker will impound them just so they can sit there while he rants about "monuments to waste"; sound familiar, New York?) they will represent a dozen or so Horizons that can be reassigned and provide more capacity.

Regarding Condr 1007's observation, in all likelihood, the Hiawathas will have to require reservations - and turn otherwise paying passengers into Megabus devotees.

I continue to think that $5/ga will be a 'resistance' point; what else must I think when I see one of my McMansionite neighbors walking by carrying a shopping bag and says she is "off to Kramers (a specialty grocery store); gas is too expensive" - and there I see her Chevy Suburban sitting in their drive.

gokeefe wrote:As noted above and on the Amtrak Success Stories thread ridership is very high right now especially in Illinois.

Just exactly how close are the Illinois services to running out of capacity?

Are we talking about trains that are running crush loads seven days a week or some other kind of ridership pattern?

In short how much more can these trains grow?

If they do grow beyond current capacity does Amtrak have enough cars entering the fleet from ARRA rebuilds to cover potential growth?

Given that tomorrow's four Lincoln Service trains offer seats Chgo-Spfld. for $18, $24, $24 and $18, my guess would be that these trains aren't overloaded. I don't disparage the growth by saying that. But there seems to be a fair amount of room left.

A seat Chgo-Spfld on the Texas Eagle would be $51.

Friday's a bit brisker, with seats for $18, $33, $51 and $33, with the Eagle sold out or putatively sold out (perhaps they hold a few short distance sales to allow for a through ticket?) for that stretch. Monday's prices aren't relevant in my opinion because of a bustitution from Bloomington. Looking ahead to Wed. May 11th, 3 of 4 Lincoln trains offer seats for $18.

I'd add that those prices are astonishingly good when you consider that in a typical car getting about 25 miles/gallon, the 400 mile round-trip would cost $64 in gas alone. In my pick-up (though I'd probably choose my wife's car for the trip), it'd cost me about $100. (To give proper context, you have to double the $18 fare to come up with a $36 round-trip, a savings of $28-$64.)

Illinois get $186 million from the Florida money for Dwight to Joliet.

"About $186 million in federal funding that Florida turned down for high-speed passenger rail has been awarded to Illinois for improvements on part of the 110 mph corridor between Chicago and St. Louis, officials announced today."

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... ?track=rss

Related of sorts to Illinois service is the status of Porter IN-Chicago IL track improvements.

There was an allocation of some $200M between IL and IN for such under ARRA '09 "$8B for HSR"; I'm unaware of any Local rescissions (i.e. FL, OH, WI) of the funds, but little has been reported regarding such.

As I noted earlier, I had occasion to ride CHI-350(23APR)-DET-353(25APR)-CHI and, even though the ridership was strong on both trains, this ride is simply too "torturous" (away from Amtrak owned KZoo-Porter) to be considered a viable Corridor route. I guess there is a degree of "captive market" with the several on-line educational institutions, but for attracting passengers with choices, i.e. an auto, I would think this service is sadly lacking. Mr. Dunville noted at another topic the service is completely impracticable for business travel, whereas services such as CHI-MKE and CHI-SPI are quite so.

The passengers I observed appeared young (likely students); and somehow I think did not have autos available in which to make the trip.

So why was I there (owning a perfectly roadworthy auto) ? my destination was Downtown Detroit and I was only staying overnight (Detroit Symphony performance) and taxicabs were "just fine' for my needs. Finally, FWIW, I was apprehensive about parking a Japanese auto in Detroit - even with a hotel valet.

Additionally, it is taking forever to get the Englewood flyover done too. Anybody know what the delay is in this situation?

Gilbert B Norman wrote:. Finally, FWIW, I was apprehensive about parking a Japanese auto in Detroit - even with a hotel valet.

LOL I definitely had a good chuckle on that myself as I share the same fear with my new japaneese tinker toy http://www.flickr.com/photos/8453967@N0 ... hotostream

As for megabus I agree with you Mr. Norman if the Hiawatha becomes " by reservation only" I see the masses running to the big blue bus. Note I've personally taken both from DET to CHI (2009) and albeit riding the rails was much more enjoyable and spacious the cost I paid on the big blue bus for booking in advance (1/3 of my Amtrak ticket cost) made up for the missing amenities, horrible hard seat, and bumpy ride. I at the time said... if this was only a shorter trip say less than 2 hrs it would be quite bearable, @ that time the big blue bus did not have service from Milwaukee to Chicago.


I see the Florida " maybe we want it, maybe we don't " funds were shifted north with IL getting a nice chunk of change so far... I did not hear about this on any of the local Florida news outlets, however as the temp has risen down south I flew the coop with the rest of the snow birds for the north and now I'll do a balancing act of Toronto/Chicago for the next few months can't wait to see all the rail improvements that have been going on in the Chicagoland area.

However I Just have one question as Ive been in hibernation for a while.. are we really or ever getting talgo cars for Chicago -Milwaukee , any real confirmation yet?

Two Talgo trainsets ARE coming. It was a done deal, even before the current Guv threw away the "$800m for HSR". Expected delivery is supposed to be 2012.

I have not heard anything from Talgo or WisDOT for a few months, though.

Gilbert B Norman wrote:Related of sorts to Illinois service is the status of Porter IN-Chicago IL track improvements.

There was an allocation of some $200M between IL and IN for such under ARRA '09 "$8B for HSR"; I'm unaware of any Local rescissions (i.e. FL, OH, WI) of the funds, but little has been reported regarding such.

From Marriott Courtyard Roswell GA--

There has been an Amtrak Press Release today on "the HAJJ" announcing an upcomung announcement to be made in Detroit; could there be help on the way?

http://www.freep.com/article/20110507/N ... RONTPAGE|s

Sorry, no "brief passage" this hotel lobby computer is "really slow".(some guest must be downloading a 20 meg movie or something).

Is this in addition to the cars and locos that were a part of the first $1.1B that Illinois got? How long might it be before these are in use?

Midwest Corridors – $268.2 million to purchase 48 high-performance passenger rail cars and 7 quick-acceleration locomotives for 8 corridors in the Midwestern States: Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Michigan, and Missouri.

http://www.fra.dot.gov/roa/press_releas ... 7-11.shtml

jstolberg made another excellent post to the "Amtrak Success Stories" thread.

Buried in the details was the interesting (to say the least) news that apparently the Adirondack has gone net positive due to high ridership. Following the link to the March 2011 Amtrak Monthly Report (and 'turning' to pdf page 60) one finds some additional items of interest as well.

Specifically among certain trains of the Illinois Service which apparently are on the cusp of the same achievement themselves.

To be fair I don't know if these numbers include state contributions or not (I think they don't).

But regardless using Total Revenue/(Total Costs+OPEB & Other Costs) the farebox recovery ratios are apparently getting 'dangerously' close to 100%. Figures are in the millions. Farebox recovery ratios were rounded to the nearest 0.1%. I'm pretty sure this has to be a historic performance for these trains.

Chicago-St. Louis: 17.0/(16.7+0.8=17.5)=97.1% (Pretty sure this includes some non-state supported trains)
Hiawathas: 11.5/(11.2+0.6=11.8)=97.5%

Several of the other Chicago services are doing 'well' or better. But none of them come as close as these two do. In fact other than the Adirondack, Lynchburg Regional and the Kansas City-St.Louis trains, the above two are the only services which are currently covering costs before OPEB & Other Costs.

I can't even begin to imagine how long its been since any train out of Chicago came so close to covering its fully allocated costs, to include Railroad Retirement and any other special charges. I would be interested to know how this methodology compares to the old "ICC" formula with its illusions of profit.

[Edit: Month of report changed to "March 2011"]

I was googling for info on the Chicago-St. Louis corridor status and found a IDOT website Illinois High Speed Rail: http://www.idothsr.org/ Is this a new website? Some useful info and links to a number of official documents under the Information Center tab.