• UTU Press conference regarding service cuts

  • Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.
Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.

Moderator: Liquidcamphor

  by goodnightjohnwayne
 
ADL6009 wrote:
goodnightjohnwayne wrote:
LongIslandTool wrote: In another craft, the AWOL statistics are so absurd that the MTA is demanding that the ranks be trimmed. A six month investigation was completed where suspected employees' homes were placed under surveillance using cameras in unmarked cars in conjunction with cell phone and EZPass records. As well more than half of the bottom of that roster has been found to be at home when they should be completing their assignments, the Railroad wants to just rid itself of many of them outright.
If people are actually submitting fraudulent time records, aren't they subject to firing and even criminal prosecution?

not if you've been here longer than 10 years. then you can do anything you want and if someome else points it out they are obviously in the wrong for doing so. just ask tool.
I guess the real question is what can the voters and taxpayers do to end this phenomenon of absent and/or "no show" workers on the LIRR?
  by Datenail
 
I guess the real question is what can the voters and taxpayers do to end this phenomenon of absent and/or "no show" workers on the LIRR?
The answer to that is simple. Cut the amount of staffing on the trains, facilities, etc. With higher on-board ticket fees, new equipment, more shop automation, modern track equipment, etc., we don't need as many people anymore. If employees can be AWOL and insist on a full days pay for their "work", then it's obvious the staffing levels are too high. And they will be cut whether they like it or not and relieve the taxpayers of the burden of their excessive salaries and benefits. The constant attacks on managment by those workers, many of whom are stealing their salaries by being AWOL, is a hypocrisy. If all employees performed their work as they are paid to do, there would be no need for the amount of managers to police employees. The situation is chronic and please save the "few bad apples" nonsense. Jay Walder of the MTA should be celebrated as a hero and carried on the shoulders of every taxpayer in our great State.
  by ADL6009
 
Datenail wrote:
I guess the real question is what can the voters and taxpayers do to end this phenomenon of absent and/or "no show" workers on the LIRR?
The answer to that is simple. Cut the amount of staffing on the trains, facilities, etc. With higher on-board ticket fees, new equipment, more shop automation, modern track equipment, etc., we don't need as many people anymore. If employees can be AWOL and insist on a full days pay for their "work", then it's obvious the staffing levels are too high. And they will be cut whether they like it or not and relieve the taxpayers of the burden of their excessive salaries and benefits. The constant attacks on managment by those workers, many of whom are stealing their salaries by being AWOL, is a hypocrisy. If all employees performed their work as they are paid to do, there would be no need for the amount of managers to police employees. The situation is chronic and please save the "few bad apples" nonsense. Jay Walder of the MTA should be celebrated as a hero and carried on the shoulders of every taxpayer in our great State.

when they eliminate your position will you still be one of those tax payers carrying Jay Walder on your shoulders?
  by Datenail
 
when they eliminate your position will you still be one of those tax payers carrying Jay Walder on your shoulders?
Actually my position is filled by one person, myself, so I won't be laid-off. Unskilled, overstaffed positions such as yours will be chopped. I noticed how you talk like a real "union man" until your job was threatened. Then you post on here about fellow senior train service employees getting a free ride and being AWOL. Like a little tattle tail crying that his a** isn't kissed because when you steal your salary jumping off the train before your tour is finished, you get punished but the senior guy doesn't. Earn your stripes pal like the rest of us. I have 31 years on the Rail Road and new guys like you had to pay your dues then and will pay them now. If you don't like it, leave. Some union man you are, like a rat crying "what about him!!!". Hey hypocrate, those senior employees earned their respect. Now when you are laid-off from your railroad job and working the drive-up window at McD's, we'll visit you and make fun of your new uniform.
  by utu man
 
A lot of the old timers in the 60's and 70's took no prisoners.
Anyone remember "Turn em in Tully"? If you missed his train, you might as well go home, you were turned in.
Amazing how no one ever missed his train, without a legit excuse.
Then there was J.W. In the 80' and 90's no one would miss his trains either, afraid they would be turned in.
In J.W.s case he did not turn anyone in, he just perpetuated the reputation that he would, and it worked. He always had his collectors.
  by bluelightbynight
 
Datenail what do you expect; union employees are going to bash management and say there is alot of fat and managemnet employees like you ( and you seem to have a very serious problem with trainmen that is almost personal) are going to bash union employees. Mangement is going to get a 10% cut( thats going to hurt especially if you gave the railroad all of that time) and union employees are going to be cut. Morale is very low since rumors are flying and no one knows what is going to happen. It would be nice if someone would let all employees, mgt and union know what the plans are. Everyone has this in the back of their head and can be a distraction. That is not good when safety is of the first importance in the discharge of duty.
  by bluelightbynight
 
While we are on the subject of going home early. Mangement is going to be punching in and out( just like the employees at Mcd's) because alot of them go home early. So please don't bring up bailing unless you bring up bailing by mgt too.
  by 2behind1
 
Datenail wrote:
I guess the real question is what can the voters and taxpayers do to end this phenomenon of absent and/or "no show" workers on the LIRR?
The answer to that is simple. Cut the amount of staffing on the trains, facilities, etc. With higher on-board ticket fees, new equipment, more shop automation, modern track equipment, etc., we don't need as many people anymore. If employees can be AWOL and insist on a full days pay for their "work", then it's obvious the staffing levels are too high. And they will be cut whether they like it or not and relieve the taxpayers of the burden of their excessive salaries and benefits. The constant attacks on managment by those workers, many of whom are stealing their salaries by being AWOL, is a hypocrisy. If all employees performed their work as they are paid to do, there would be no need for the amount of managers to police employees. The situation is chronic and please save the "few bad apples" nonsense. Jay Walder of the MTA should be celebrated as a hero and carried on the shoulders of every taxpayer in our great State.

Very self serving, indeed, Nail. Hope to see you hiding behind the wall at Woodside station at 1am to catch all those "bad apples.

BTW: The LIRR being a "company" went out the window in 1965. Draw your own conclusions on what to call it now.
  by 2behind1
 
utu man wrote:A lot of the old timers in the 60's and 70's took no prisoners.
Anyone remember "Turn em in Tully"? If you missed his train, you might as well go home, you were turned in.
Amazing how no one ever missed his train, without a legit excuse.
Then there was J.W. In the 80' and 90's no one would miss his trains either, afraid they would be turned in.
In J.W.s case he did not turn anyone in, he just perpetuated the reputation that he would, and it worked. He always had his collectors.

Actually, JW was too busy collecting cans.

JD was another one in KO (before electrification)where no one dared missed his train. One second late? He would be puffing on his pipe to the crew dispacter for your replacement with glee.
  by MJohnson21
 
Yea it aint looking good for union employees unfortunately with all the rumors flying around, my good friend is a newly qualified engineer and he worries every day about not having a job after putting 15 months of hard work into becoming an engineer, he wishes at this point he had stayed a trainmen since he had a lot more men under him then he does as an engineer, and he claims his old union says that he is now a qualified engineer that he cannot go back to being a trainmen ecen tho he is paying his union dues still, its just a terrible situation for all employees of the MTA
  by Fla East Coast Chris
 
2behind1 JW would save the cans and also look at his stock papers!!!!
  by RogerOverOutRR
 
I suggest to all the newly qualified Engineers that are reading this that were once trainmen, be proactive before the storm hits and call the UTU International to protest. The UTU has NO grounds on refusing to take you back in case of an Engineer furlough. As long as those union dues are still coming out of your check each week, there's no reason they can refuse you coming back. Don't sit on your ass and wait for someone else to speak up. Your interests are not A.S.'s interests!
  by ADL6009
 
Datenail wrote:
when they eliminate your position will you still be one of those tax payers carrying Jay Walder on your shoulders?
Actually my position is filled by one person, myself, so I won't be laid-off. Unskilled, overstaffed positions such as yours will be chopped. I noticed how you talk like a real "union man" until your job was threatened. Then you post on here about fellow senior train service employees getting a free ride and being AWOL. Like a little tattle tail crying that his a** isn't kissed because when you steal your salary jumping off the train before your tour is finished, you get punished but the senior guy doesn't. Earn your stripes pal like the rest of us. I have 31 years on the Rail Road and new guys like you had to pay your dues then and will pay them now. If you don't like it, leave. Some union man you are, like a rat crying "what about him!!!". Hey hypocrate, those senior employees earned their respect. Now when you are laid-off from your railroad job and working the drive-up window at McD's, we'll visit you and make fun of your new uniform.
ok Mr Nail, since you have no idea who i really am let us clear up some misconceptions:

1- i am a conductor and i have over 8 years time on the property, i am not 'wet behind the ears'.
I have hundreds of people below me on the conductor roster and i am in no danger of being furloughed, laid off or whatever you wish to call it.
I will not be giving up my RR uniform for a McDonalds uniform anytime soon, in fact i will still be in this uniform when you are long dead and buried.

2- I have a very good work eithic and make it a point to always be where i am supposed to be when i am supposed to be there. you can accuse all trainmen of being AWOL all the time, but this is one case where it will not stick. i do not call in sick and i have NEVER gotten an AWOL or a Run Failure or a Late Start. I currently own a conductors job so i do not have the option of 'bailing' as so many of my collectors who have much more time than me have earned the right to do so.

3- Just because you are the 'only person in your position' does not gurantee you any kind of job security. there is afterall only 'one' president but they seem to come and go all the time. there is no one so important that the RR could not function without them or replace them with someone who makes half as much money. or abolish the position altogether. you are not as important as you like to think you are. the RR seemed to do to just fine the 144 years it was around before you showed up. for example they had no problem demoting the former GST because he was sexually harassing another male employee. he lost his position even though he was the 'only person in that position'. do not think that the RR owes you anything for being around 31 years, they owe you nothing and would not think twice about dropping you if they thought it could save them some money.

4- i believe that "bailing" or being AWOL is wrong. No Matter who does it. if you are supposed to be somewhere you should be there, whether you have 1,5,10,15,20,30,40 or 50 years on the property. I find it disgusting that you would imply that since someone has a lot of time on the property that they should be given a pass for being AWOL.

5- the amount of Disdain and disrespect you have for trainmen and engineers is really an eye opener into why this place has so many problems. I am looking forward to the day when you are long gone and we have some new competent managers running this place. one's who understand that we are all in this together.

that is all.
  by mark777
 
You know, it amazes me so much that anyone who claims to be in management would illustrate so much anger and hostility towards one craft? earlier today conversations between a few managers and employees as well as myself discussed how employee morale was so low, how so much tension exists in the work place, and how even Helena herself is concerned about the morale problem. With quickness, we pointed out how a number of people in management display hostility towards the employees, almost on a crusade to find something, anything that would draw a bad picture of a labor based employees, perhaps even going as far as to fabricate a story. And if that seperation is not addressed, at some point sooner or later, somebody will get hurt or worse.

Datenail: you obviously have extreme issues, and how anyone with that type of behavior that you are displaying here can be accepted anywhere in any work place is beyond me. You treat your job and your "postion" with an almost goon mentality that should have you fired if anything. You seem to be very confident that your job is a sure thing. But with the amount of years you claim to have on the LIRR, it would be understandable that one foot is probably already out the door. Like so many who approach the finish line, we tend to build up that frustration that was pinned inside for so many years. And yep, much like they will look at the young ones, the old ones will be smoked out aswell. Railroad needs to still function in the future, so how absurd would it be for them to not prepare themselves for the next generation? So I would be more inclined to say at this point that nobody's job is safe, not even the president of the LIRR. I must also say that I applaud Jay Walder as well, because he has been the first Chairman in ages to make mention of cuts to management, (the biggest expense on the payroll), and if you honestly had a true insight to things, you would notice that it's not all union employees who are shaking in their shoes, but managers as well, many who are so concerned, that they are actively looking for a way to safe guard their postion by going above the means of proper protocol and creating things out of the woodworks. And while I chit chat on this site, not revealing anything of major importance, you continue to speak as if you would'nt suffer any consequences for providing so much information. So much excitement you must get out of stirring the pot! You have turned a job into some competition where you feel the need to instigate conflict with others in the work place. While many of us simply come into to work to simply make a living and to go home in one piece, others have a need to cause friction, to make things into an almost HIgh School type atmosphere. And then commuters and Tax payers wonder why money is simply burned faster than it comes in at the MTA? We talk so much about this epidemic of Trainmen bailing from their jobs that we get distracted of all the other illnesses that have infected this place. So much incompetence, so much ignorance exist in this company, and yet you can sit their and boast of your value to the company and to Tax Payers as if you had the answers to everything that is wrong with the LIRR. I'm a tax payer too, and what I see is that my taxes keep going up, some of it heading to the MTA. And yet here we are now, talking about services cuts, laying off employees, rasing fares again. You know, if you are so passionate about doing the public a service, why then would you be up there in agreement with all of these cuts and increases in fares? Do you think that your job will exist if you didn't have those commuters and Tax payers filling up the wallets of the MTA? I know I wouldn't, and yet I have been first in line for years stating how important it is to keep fares reasonable and to keep service at a premium. If this company were in the private sector, it would have closed long ago, and caused by the abuses of all of those who have milked the system on both sides of the fence. So don't come here bickering about how one craft has melted the system while so many fat cats behind desks continue to milk it for all it's worth.

You and I both know that all of this is nothing more than a political Poker game to see who bluffs better, and the outcome of it will ride on this exactly. So really, I say quit the nonesense already. I watch everyday with my own eyes watching employees, both labor and management, milking the system for all its worth. If half of HSF and Jamaica were forced to punch in and out, which is what Management will start doing very soon, the sunny days for many will end, and end fast. I don't care what anyone in my craft thinks, you want us to punch in and out? I don't have a problem with that. I did it in all of my previous Deptartments, and I have done it in my previous jobs prior to the LIRR. I don't have anything to hide because if they wanted to find me, they will, and I will be where I am suppose to be. I don't need some shmuck coming up to me who never worked a train, or even qualified for that matter come to me and tell me anything or where I should be, or when I should be there. I don't need anyone to hold my hand and walk me through the day. I didn't have anyone holding my hand when I qualified, when I knocked my head off trying to study, trying to pass the test ONCE! NO. Don't need any help thank you. No, there is no perfect on our side of the fence, but please cut the c**p and stop acting like you guys are all sints up there. If competence existed in the vast majority of the positions on the LIRR, we would see a totally different LIRR out there, but we don't, and I still believe that the LIRR did so purposely. In any case, I hope for everyone out there has read all of this can see what lurks behind the curtain before this gets locked at some point. Yes, this is what exist both here in the LIRR and probably in other places as well. There is your answer, your explanation all in writing to what is wrong with the picture and why your wallets will always have another hand in it reaching in.
  by Steamboat Willie
 
ADL, I enjoyed your most recent post. Nicely said.

Datenail, your scope of criticism, specifically train service seems to have a deeper meaning. You continue to dodge the same question everyone has asked about your feeling amongst represented crafts. You insulting every represented craft up and down the RR employs is a repulsive vibe. Has the LIRR grown over the decades to the point where it warranted excessive management? The company still ran decades ago when ridership was higher than it is currently with a fraction of the management it employs present day.

Your 31 years of employment with the company, provided the majority of the years was exclusively in management should have taught you one thing. Things get stale from the top and work its way to the bottom. It is poor leadership to display weakness. It appears that management in all areas, not just train service, is lackluster being it cannot control these types of unethical behaviors. That either means you have poor talent in the field or they are just as lazy as the people they are trying to hang.

In any craft, represented or not, you always, always have underachievers, Datenail. I am sure you have had to work with people not up to your caliber of skill. To say everyone whom was in the ranks of management was an ace in the hole is also another irrational conclusion. Please direct your attention to the special mention of the GST stated above.

I am insulted by your remarks. There are, despite what you think Datenail, some honest people who devote a lot of their life into making it in a career such as railroading. These are the folks who are working some wild train to Ronkonkoma after a big Ranger game, the track workers digging ditches in sub zero weather, the signal department getting back the place up and running after a blackout, Train Dispatchers trying to keep the places flowing after a train took out one of their mainline tracks during rush hour to the people who are constantly repairing the square wheels to a sub par EMU fleet.

I am sure someone of your stature who has been around for a few decades will remain with an unchanged opinion. But you are as blind as Ray Charles to the truth thinking you are indispensable on any level. The place will continue to run with or without you the next day. That goes for people who are the President to the people cleaning the stations.