GN/BN Empire Builder Question?

Discussion relating to the BN, and its predecessors GN, NP, CB&Q, SP&S, SL-SF, and their subsidiaries. Visit the Friends of the Burlington Northern for more information.
AmtrakFan

GN/BN Empire Builder Question?

Post by AmtrakFan »

What was the Empire Builders Consist in the late 50's and early 60's? Also what was it in BN Days?

AmtrakFan

User avatar
2nd trick op
Posts: 1589
Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 7:40 pm
Location: Nescopeck, PA ..... NS Sunbury Line MP 715

A Reference Source

Post by 2nd trick op »

The exact date escapes me, but if you can get access to back copies of TRAINS, possibly through a major library, there is an excellent narrative of a trip on the Empire Bulder, sometime around 1960. The name of the article was "The Clean Window Train". Good Luck.

AmtrakFan

Post by AmtrakFan »

Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AmtrakFan

bill haithcoat

gn/bn empire builders quesiton

Post by bill haithcoat »

Amtrak fan--I just discovered this question of yours (from September and October) today. I don't know if you are still interested, or if you have found some info otherwise.

However, I should be able to help you with this next week, around Feb. 15 or so ----- my computer is at home, I am at work, and I will be on vacation after today and until next Tuesday.

Meanwhile, from memory, (at the office), I recall it being something like this: maybe about 3 coaches and 3 pullmans CHI to - Seattle, maybe about two each to Portland. A diner, a great dome, Some of the coaches will have domes.

Keep in mind in later years it and its archrival, Northern Pacific"s "North Coast Limited"(similar equipment) ran combined from CHI to the Twin Cities, on CB&Q or later BN tracks. As I recall, I sort of think the Portland sections of these two trains ran combined between Spokane and Portland, also.

In the early days of Amtrak, there was a train called the "North Coast Hiawatha". That name was meant to evoke the memory of both the North Coast Liimited and the Olympian Hiwatha, a Milwaukee train to Seattle and Tacoma.

AmtrakFan

Post by AmtrakFan »

Yes I am still intersted.

CarterB
Posts: 2784
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 9:19 am
Location: Bergen County, New Jersey

Post by CarterB »

Sometime soon after "A Day", (1971-72) I rode one of the few Dome/Lounge/Sleepers from Chicago to Seattle. (I think Empire Builder? maybe North Coast Hiawatha?) (I do remember going via Minot, ND and
I seem to remember it had been repainted in the GN/BN "all blue" scheme? I do remember that I had one of the few duplex single rooms and that the car had a "Lounge in the Sky" Anyone know the color scheme/s of the "soon after A Day" sleeper domes?
Bring back the Slumbercoaches!!

bill haithcoat

gn/bn empire builder question

Post by bill haithcoat »

I brought in a timetable for April 27, 1969, it seems to be representative. Seems the consist did not change too much during the years, except it was normally longer in the summer.

here goes:

60 seat coach CHI-Sea
46 seats dome coach CHI-SEA(summer only)
46 seats dome coach Chi-Sea
48 seat coach St. Paul Seattle (summer only)
48 seats coach St. Paul Portland(summer only)
46 seat dome coach Chi-Portland
Ranch lounge Chi-Sea(lounge for caoch passengrs)
Diner Chi-Seattle and Portland
Pullmans, 6 roomette 5 double bedroom 2 compartment. Chi Sea(Summer only)
7 duplex roomette, 6 dbr, 1 compt, Chi-Sea
6 rmt 5 dbr 2 compt Chi-Portland
6 rmte, 5 dbr, 2 compt st. paul sea(summer only)
6 rmte 3 dbr buffetlounge Spokane Portland
Great dome fulll length lounge(lower level beverage service for all passengers,upper level dome for sleeper only

Scoring Guy
Posts: 140
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:08 am
Location: Onalaska, Wisconsin

Post by Scoring Guy »

Mr. Haithcoat:
The one thing I would differ with you on here is the location of the Full Length dome car: I would suggest that it would have been coupled behind the dining car and in front of the sleeping cars (for one reason it would have been a good place for the 1st class passengers to "Que" up for meals).
The 6 roomette, 3 bedroom lounge/buffet car was basically a round ended "Coulee" observation car (re-floorplanned after the arrival of the full domes) , albeit, with not much lounge space left in the rounded end, and would certainly have been that last car in the consist, although it wasn't usually (if ever) earmarked for Portland, but rather Seattle.
:wink:

bill haithcoat

GN/BN empire builder question

Post by bill haithcoat »

No problem. You are right on both counts.


I was not attempting to list cars in exact order(as if I had seen an actual consist). I was just listing them as I found them lifted off the page of the timetable.

Perhaps the large dome was put at the rear of the listing because they thought it would stand out better that way, or sometrhing.

Scoring Guy
Posts: 140
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:08 am
Location: Onalaska, Wisconsin

Post by Scoring Guy »

Oops,
Actually I was wrong on one of these points;
Since the timetable you cited was from 1969, the GN had retired the "Coulee" observation cars by that time, so this wasn't a Chicago-Seattle observation car:
therefore, your listing of of the 6rmte, 3br,Buffet/Lounge car, was correct as a Portland/Spokane car - which was owned and operated the SP&S which shuttled the GN (and NP) thru cars between Spokane and Portland on their "Dome Streamliner", for EB and NCL, and on the #3 & #4 for the WS and MS.
I was thinking with the wrong part of my body again. Sorry.

Return to “Burlington Northern, GN, NP, CB&Q, SP&S, SL-SF”