Who owned/operated Sharks (Baldwin RF-16)?

Discussion related to Baldwin Locomotive Works, Lima Locomotive Works, Lima-Hamilton Corporation, and Baldwin-Lima-Hamilton.

Moderator: lumpy72

Hoosier Joe
Posts: 96
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2004 11:41 pm
Location: Decatur,In.

Post by Hoosier Joe » Sat Feb 05, 2005 8:54 am

I saw the sharks when they were were operated by the Michigan Northern RR at Cadillac,which is in the lower peninsula.So how did the sharks get to the upper peninsula ? Over the car ferry at Mackinaw or did they go around Chicago ? Thanks . Joe.

Posts: 150
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 10:23 pm

Post by oddball » Sat Feb 05, 2005 10:21 pm

great pics, i wish i could see what the sharks look like today....and i hope whenever they get out in the open again, someone repaints them delaware and hudson colors again, theres no better paint scheme out there, in my opinion!


Post by badneighbor » Tue Feb 08, 2005 6:55 pm

Happy Day

Engineer James
Posts: 1195
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 7:47 am
Location: South of CH 17.9 CSXT Detroit Subdivision

Post by Engineer James » Wed Jun 01, 2005 8:02 am

Look at my post over on the general equipment section, of this forum. There is a big dicussion going on!! :P


Post by Centurylover68 » Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:46 pm

Hey! I know 2 Sharks are in storage in Michigan. Could anyone telll me what condition they are in? Wouldn't it be nice if someone restored them. No, I am not thinking about seeing as I am only a teen.

User avatar
Posts: 708
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 8:41 pm
Location: Eastern, PA

Link to Shark message

Post by trainspot » Mon Jul 11, 2005 9:02 pm

Check this thread out:
http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopi ... 2&start=45

Both have been out of service since the 1980s, but stored indoors.
Hopefully, one day they will run again!

User avatar
Posts: 9548
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2004 10:21 am

Post by Tadman » Tue Jul 19, 2005 10:08 am

The sharks in Michigan are Ex-Cadillac & Lake Cities, which was also the Michigan Northern and also Grand Rapids and Indiana (PRR). The sharks came to C&LC from D&H I believe. I was not aware they were still in Michigan.
Dig the new rr.net Instagram account: @railroad_dot_net

Posts: 869
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:09 pm
Location: La Plata, MD, MP 38.8 on the Pope's Creek sub

Re: Sharks

Post by Aa3rt » Sun Sep 11, 2005 11:40 am

curmudgeon wrote: I'm trying to identify a Mantua "A" Shark I bought.
It has blk over orange paint, sim. to EJ&E scheme, looks factory, but no roadname/number.

The EJ&E purchased the original four Baldwin Shark Demonstrators,
designated model# DR4-4-1500A (& B for "B" units). The EJ&E gave the units numbers 700A, 700B, 701A & 701B. For a grainy black & white photo of these units follow the link...

EDIT-1/18/07-Apparently the "eje.railfan.net" site has disappeared into the ether. Here's a new link with a photo of a shark in EJ&E colors.


These engines were purchased by the EJ&E in January of 1950, sold to the B&O in March of 1955 and were scrapped sometime in 1962.

The EJ&E, B&O, PRR and NYC all purchased new sharks, with some of the ex-NYC units going to the Monongahela in the mid-1960's.

Units 1206 & 1215 survived the scrapper, being sold to the D&H and eventually ending up in Michigan.

The PRR also purchased the only passenger (12 wheel) sharks.

For build dates, ownership & disposition, the following links should help:

Freight (RF-16) Sharks:


Passenger (DR441500) Sharks:


Finally, for a view of of the 1205 & 1216 in NYC, Monongahela & D&H paint, follow this link:

Art Audley, AA3RT
Moderator: Railroad Radio & Communications, Railroads in Books, Magazines, Music, TV and other Media, General Discussion: Fallen Trolley & Interurban Lines, General Discussion: Shortline, Industrial & Military Railroads,


Are any Sharks left?

Post by msernak » Sat Sep 02, 2006 7:17 pm

I should know the answer to this but are there any Sharks in existance? What happened to the D & H sharks? Did they end up in Mexico like the PA's?

User avatar
Posts: 4591
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 7:18 am
Location: Rochester, NY

Post by scottychaos » Sat Sep 02, 2006 10:26 pm

The two D&H sharks still exist, been in storage for many decades..
they are the only surviving Sharks.
see here:




The last two Sharks....

Post by Mimbrogno » Fri Sep 08, 2006 3:24 pm

Yes, those two Sharks are still up in Michigan, and still in that shed. John Larken owns the shed they are housed in, infact, that's how he aquired them. Because of the tab Michigan Northern ran up storing locomotives in his shed, they offered the sharks as payment for storage. John had been interested in running trips and excursions with the sharks once he got them repaired, but unfortunatly that never happened. The shop he was having the engines rebuilt at went bankrupt, which has killed Mr. Larken's hopes of having them rebuilt. On top of that, while the engines were siting out in the open, they were vandalized, not only having horns and builder's plates stolen from them, but even whole cylinder heads STOLEN RIGHT OFF THE DIESEL ENGINE!!! Well, after this experiance, Mr. Larken said 'the hell with the world' and locked them up in the shed. He will never let them out until all of the property is returned, or he dies; at which point the locomtoives will be sold to a museum. As things stand right now and in light of their present condition, it is not very likely that they will be restored to operating condition for decades, even after they are donated to a museum.

Matthew Imbrogno
Mechanical Vollenteer - Arizona Railway Museum

Engineer James
Posts: 1195
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 7:47 am
Location: South of CH 17.9 CSXT Detroit Subdivision

Some unseen Pics of the Sharks

Post by Engineer James » Tue Sep 26, 2006 1:20 pm

Well, was stumblin around on a state railroad page and run across these pics on there of the Old Baldwin Sharks... thought I'd share them..

http://michiganrailroads.com/RRHX/Pictu ... to049A.htm

http://michiganrailroads.com/RRHX/Pictu ... to050A.htm

Enjoy.... :-)

Posts: 140
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2004 2:02 am
Location: Burlingame, CA

Post by Alloy » Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:02 pm

Thanks, James, I like those pictures. I was not familiar with Sharks until I bought a used Don Ball, Jr. photo collection, America's Colorful Railroads, [Bonanza Books, NY, 1978]. The collection was about early color photography, from 1941 to the late 50s. There was a shot of Pennsylvania #5783, heading a passenger train in 1957. The caption says that it's on the Long Branch, approaching Bayhead.

If I read the Wikipedia article correctly, it looks as if the Pennsylvania was the only road that ever had Sharks, other than the demo units that went to the Elgin, Joliet and Eastern Railroad, and then on to the B&O.
Farrell Wills

Posts: 875
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 7:37 am
Location: Someplace north of Highland Jct.


Post by H.F.Malone » Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:09 pm

Well, the only two that are left (the ex-D&H ones) are both originally New York Central locos, so it would seem that not only PRR and B&O had 'em, right?
"You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find you get what you need."

Posts: 278
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 8:29 pm

Post by Typewriters » Tue Sep 26, 2006 11:26 pm

Do watch out when dealing with those Wikipedia articles. I've found many of them just full of errors and misinformation.

To be brief, the Pennsylvania had both 1500 HP and 1600 HP four-axle Baldwin freight units in the "Shark" body, as well as 2000 HP A1A-A1A passenger units. Many of these passenger units were later derated to 1600 HP and regeared, and placed in freight service mixed with the other types originally built for such service.

Other original owners of "Shark" freight units, all 1600 HP were New York Central and Baltimore & Ohio. The Elgin, Joliet & Eastern did in fact purchase the former BLW four-unit 6000 HP demonstrator set, and later sold it to the Baltimore & Ohio.

The Pennsylvania units were all gone by the time of the Penn Central merger, but a good number of former New York Central units survived to be owned by Penn Central. A few of these units were sold in later years to the Monongahela, and from there two A units were bought by the Delaware & Hudson. These were eventually purchased for operation, ostensibly, on the Escanaba & Lake Superior as I recall, and am quite sure that both are still there -- you can find innumerable posts about these scattered all over these forums by searching.

I think that covers all the owners that used the units in revenue service.

-Will Davis

Return to “Baldwin-Lima-Hamilton”