Man sues Amtrak/Climbs on top of train/gets zapped

[jscola30]

Has this been settled yet? http://www.universalhub.com/node/16484

Guy sues Amtrak for failing to keep him from climbing on top of a train and getting zapped
By adamg - 9/13/08 - 7:59 pm

So this barhopping New Yorker up in Boston climbs on top of an Acela train at South Station late one night in 2006, reaches up and is promptly zapped with 27,000 or so volts, leading to serious burns and injuries, including the loss of his left arm. Naturally, he's suing Amtrak for gross negligence, because it failed to do enough to keep idiots from climbing on top of trains and grabbing hold of electrical wires.

[gprimr1]

I believe he won the lawsuit. Not sure.

[Cadet57]

I believe he won the lawsuit. Not sure.

If he did. Just another sad day for our legal system.

[adamg]

No, he didn't win - the case hasn't even gone to trial yet.

http://www.universalhub.com/node/28841 is a more recent update on him adding the MBTA to his suit. I just checked the online docket and, as of a couple weeks ago, the two sides were still arguing about evidence related to other such alleged incidents across the Amtrak system.

Hopkins has since added the MBTA to his lawsuit (of course). Hopkins' lawyers now want Amtrak to hand over all the documentation they have on people who have ever been electrocuted by grabbing catenary wires in general and dating back to 1991 at South Station specifically. Amtrak replies that case law holds Hopkins can't prove Amtrak negligence because of earlier accidents, that there were no catenary wires at South Station until 2001 and that, in any case, a review by the MBTA of all incidents at South Station since then show the only person injured by grabbing live overhead wires was Hopkins.

[folks- you gotta include a brief quote of the story you are linking to. - omv]

[ex Budd man]

It sounds like the Mc Donalds coffee suit. You buy coffee with the understanding that will be hot, if you are rash enough to place a hot cup of coffee between your legs and it scalds you don't blame the coffee!
I remember a line from the movie Mash where Frank Burns said 'It's Gods will or somebody elses fault' when a patient died. Drunk or not the fool who climbed on top of the train was responsible for his own actions. He should not be rewarded for being stupid, if anything he should go around to schools showing kids the consequences of stupidity.

[CHANGEATJAMAICA]

After reading Hopkin's council's request to the court it is obvious a lot of $100+/hours have been spent thus far. Even if Mr. Hopkin's wins his suit, he and his family will see very little of the gross award.

As an aside: No one in the Commonwealth is required to serve on a jury after he/she is seventy years old. I have relatively recently attained such an august status but cheerfully continue to allow my name to be drawn periodically for service. The reason is twofold. First, while my physical agility and stamina attest to my age; my mental capacities are as sharp or sharper than ever and it would be a waste to not allow their use in the search for justice in the court system. Second; I would hope there were others of my ilk, who are willing to provide their services, especially if I were involved in a court action as either the plaintive or accused to allow the justice system to be "just".

Best regards,
Rodger

[Gilbert B Norman]

There "just ain't much call" for Jurors in DuPage County Illinois. Crime is low, and what of it there is will largely be adjudicated at a "bench' trial, and civil litigators find more sympathetic juries in Cook County (after all "location, location,location; OJ walked in LA, yet got nailed for $$$ in Santa Monica, really nailed, i.e. the slammer, in Clark Cty NV) I've resided at same address in an owner-occupied dwelling now 31 years and have never been called. I hope the dozen or so here who know me face-to-face will afirm that I am a competent adult.

If they want me, they can find me.

[andegold]

He may win, especially given the recent history of the electrification. Having said that don't think for a minunte that I think he should win, only that he may. NJT's Princeton Branch (ie "The Dinky") has been electrified since the '50s or whenever the PRR electrified the Northeast Corridor. That didn't stop some stupid jury, in the 1980s I think, from awarding millions to the family of a drunken college student who climbed up on top while the train was parked for the night at the station. As a result the train no longer sits in Princeton where it begins the first run of the morning but deadheads back to Princeton Junction to sit in a cage topped with barbed wire until the first run of the morning.

[george matthews]

He's lucky not to feature in a Darwin Award (for removing himself from the gene pool).

[justalurker66]

As a result the train no longer sits in Princeton where it begins the first run of the morning but deadheads back to Princeton Junction to sit in a cage topped with barbed wire until the first run of the morning.

That may be what he is fishing for ... and the reason why the defense is reluctant to hand the information over.

We live in a country with attractive nuisance laws. If it is a place where children are likely to trespass, could cause death or bodily harm and is not obviously dangerous/deadly (we're talking in a child's eyes, not an adult with experience around the hazard). If the owner does not take reasonable care in protecting the trespasser they can be held liable. This is why people are required to put a fence and child locked gate around their private pools - to reduce liability when some kid trespasses and drowns. (I've worked for years around broadcast towers which are required to be fenced so it is harder for some moron to decide to climb it at jump/fall off. No fence and the owner can be fined even if no one trespasses.)

While the trespasser is no child, showing that there were reasonable actions that could have been taken to prevent the death may sway a jury. NJT's action of tucking the train away where it is harder to trespass on is a reasonable action. Cutting the power to trains not in service could be a reasonable action.

We are some of the most railroad smart people in the world here ... we know that wire carries a lot more power than can touch and survive intact. I'm not sure if it is fully understood that this is more than a 9v on your tongue type of shock and I've seen people play with 110v power getting minor shocks for thrills. Not everyone is as smart as us. Find 12 people that either don't know the danger of electrocution or agree that the danger isn't common knowledge (or one judge if not a jury trial) and the plaintiff wins.

As far as how the case is going ... I believe the plaintiff should be doing the research. Asking the defendant to do their homework for them seems like it would violate some rule about self incrimination. The information provided in their response is enough to go on ... few problems at that time of night and no other electrocutions on their system. Let the plaintiff prove their point instead of placing the burden of proof on the defense.

[David Benton]

Are there any signs at all that high voltage electricity is present ???

[JLJ061]

Any rational person would know any electric line would have enough juice to turn someone into a crispy critter, but then again rationality today is pretty much dead as a doornail.

Personally I think it's kinda too bad he survived, otherwise another one less idiot in the gene pool we have to deal with!

[Tadman]

In fact, railroads essentially began the attractive nuisance body of case law with CB&Q v. Krayenbuhl. It's the case used by most tort law casebooks to illustrate the concept of attractive nuisance. If I remember right, the shift ended at a CB&Q roundhouse. A child walked over to the deserted turntable and somehow managed to cut its foot off in the process of horsing around on the turntable. CB&Q was found liable because the turntable wasn't locked down and was thus an attractive nuisance.

[ryanov]

It sounds like the Mc Donalds coffee suit. You buy coffee with the understanding that will be hot, if you are rash enough to place a hot cup of coffee between your legs and it scalds you don't blame the coffee!
I remember a line from the movie Mash where Frank Burns said 'It's Gods will or somebody elses fault' when a patient died. Drunk or not the fool who climbed on top of the train was responsible for his own actions. He should not be rewarded for being stupid, if anything he should go around to schools showing kids the consequences of stupidity.

You actually don't know what you're talking about with regard to the coffee suit. It's not my job to teach you, but go read something about it before you make snap judgments.

[ryanov]

Are there any signs at all that high voltage electricity is present ???

I'm pretty sure it's written on the train itself in a few places.