All things Pennsylvanian AND Keystone West

[strench707]

I would have made the Amfleet II the buisnessclass car on that train, I think it would be about as good as buisnessclass with the bigger windows.

Davis

[shadyjay]

This same thing happens on occasion on the Vermonter, which typically runs with 5 cars (4 Amfleet I coaches / 1 Amfleet I cafe/2-1 business class). Usually at least a couple of the coaches on the train are former Metroliner Service coaches and have wider spacing between seat rows, foot rests, thicker seat cushions, and curtains on the windows.

As Business Class is usually sold out on the medium-distance trains, and to standardize on the "business class" upgrade, Amtrak would make more money and keep their BC passengers satisfied if they took those "business class" coaches and made them all 2-1 seating. Surprised that hasn't happened yet.

[spacecadet]

I'll be less likely to travel on business class now on the Pennsylvanian. When it had the half cafe/half business class car, business class meant 2-1 leather seating. The full business class coaches have 2-2 cloth upholstered seats. I'm not even sure the seat pitch is greater, as coach class on the Pennsylvanian uses Amfleet II coaches with a similar seat pitch.

It has Amfleet II LD coaches all the time?

If so, then yeah, BC is a ripoff if this continues. I looked at the pics and I do see what looks like one Amfleet I BC car, several Amfleet II coaches and a cafe car. The seat pitch in the low-density Amfleet II coaches is exactly the same (I believe) as Amfleet I BC. 60 seats per car.

[checkthedoorlight]

The Amfleet-I Capstone BC cars are a ripoff. The only real benefit to paying the extra $30 or so for them is a less crowded (and less NOISY) car. The actual seat upgrade is minimal. Unless it's thanksgiving weekend, I'd gladly stick with coach.

The Amfleet-I Club Dinette BC cars on the other hand.....are nicer seating than even the Acela First Class!

The routes which are SUPPOSED to have these cars are 66/67 on the NEC (remember that this consist also has a baggage car, which limits it to 110mph, not to mention the crazy padding, and I'm not talking about the seat), the Pennsylvanian, Palmetto, Vermonter (the ONLY Club Dinette BC that does 125 mph!), Downeaster, and all of the Empire service trains except the LSL and Adirondack

[strench707]

I was on a Lynchburg Regional last week. Our consist was pretty crazy:

AEM-7
Buisnessclass
Coach (Quiet)
Cafe
Coach
Coach
Buisnessclass
Buisnessclass
Buisnessclass

The first car was the actual buisnessclass but the last three were treated as coaches even though they said buisnessclass on the outside and looked it on the inside. It seemed the whole consist was pretty screwy and the somewhat clueless conductor said that they "needed them in DC"

Anyways that was my first Buisnessclass experience and I think they should just make that the standard, keep the seating arrangement at High Capacity but that should be the standard.

Davis

[jonmurr]

The Pennsylvanian, the six times I've ridden since 2008 was four AII's and a Cafe 2-1 Business five times. The flier was one consist out of NYP with 3 AII's and one AI. As I walked down the platform, I said to myself "I guarantee they will put the Pittsburgh people in this coach." My cynicism was duly rewarded. At Philly, I pulled my seat check and moved to a AII. Nine hours with no footrest is unpleasant. Any route with AII coaches, business class is overpriced. The paper is nice, and I will admit to paying the premium on a Sunday morning Regional out of Boston to NYP. That baby was packed. And the cafe attendant let me have additional pops over my business allocation. Definitely agree the 2-1 seating is necessary off the corridor to make the additional fare reasonable.

[BuddSilverliner269]

Today was my relief day from work and me and my fiance are watching her 2 nephews for the week so we decided to take them out to Strasburg.We rode the 1:30 pm departure and as luch would have it, when we arrived in Paradise, train 42 came by and it had 6 cars, with the consist decribed earlier. I will see Thursday if it still has that consist.

[strench707]

Sounds like it may be a more permanent change because of the multiple sitings. Maybe at least for an extended period of time.

Thanks for keeping us posted Budd!

Davis

[NJTSmurf]

Thanks for the updates Budd, I'll be taking 42 on Friday to Philly. Will definitely need to take a walk through the consist!

[Jersey Jeff]

This may not be a new development. About 10 years ago I was riding the Pennsy from PGH-NWK and my BC ticket got me a seat in a regular AII...no 2-1 seating.

However, I've ridden the Pennsy twice this year and both times BC passengers were in the cafe car with 2-1 seating. Believe me, those nice, comfy seats help those 9 hours pass quite well!

[Matt Johnson]

I observed the Pennsylvanian on Wednesday with 6 cars. Honestly, I'm not sure what business class offers over coach if they no longer have the 2-1 leather seating. A business class Amfleet I has the same seat pitch as an Amfleet II, and smaller windows to boot. I wouldn't bother with it just for a complimentary soda or coffee!

[Gilbert B Norman]

Mr.Johnson, as I noted over at the related Business Class topic, it appears The Pennsylvanian is simply a victim of its own success. There have been reports here that when a car with 2-1 seating was operated, sell-outs were frequent. Therefore Business Class became a 70 seat 2-2 "coach'. Unfortunately, the Business Class accommodation charge is not sufficient to allow too many 2-1 configured cars.

Beyond the complimentary Soda Pop, Business Class does not offer any amenities - and Amtrak wisely has not suggested that there are any. I for one, use it on trips where offered; while I certainly respect those here (safe to say all considerably younger than am I) that say "it's not worth it", to minimize the possibility of having to sit in the middle of the "moshing pit' environment represented by any full up passenger transportation vehicle/craft is simply "worth it' to me.

[jonmurr]

Each time I rode in the last three years, Mr. Norman, Business was indeed sold out. I would agree with your implication that the Business class, in lieu of actual additional amenities, primarily exits for those patrons that desire a higher probability of a peaceful trip. My anecdotal evidence would reinforce that it is usually more civil and well, aged in Business. The silver lining is there are now more cafe booths, as previously you had six booths for 300 people. (I don't count the Conductor booth and the storage booth apparent in every cafe' I have ever patronized.)

[Hamhock]

Would it be financially impractical to have an entire business-class car converted to 2-1 seating? I suppose such cars would either need to be created in sufficient number to be used elsewhere, or held captive to the Pennsylvanian service...

[BuddSilverliner269]

OK Im alil late on here, but thursday I had 42, and of course had the 6 cars so Im guessing this will be a change that will stay permanent for the time being.